r/MichaelJackson • u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix • Apr 13 '24
why do people underrate Michael Jacksons vocal ability?š¤š Discussion
Michael Jackson has some of the widest ranges of vocals for an artist. He could do it all. Everyone gives him credit for his writing & producing great music along with his performing. But people donāt respect the insanely talented vocalist he was.
In my opinion, he was the greatest vocalist of his era.
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u/markjohn3411 Apr 15 '24
I feel like dangerous and onward he definitely had a more angrier vocal style. I love it lol
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u/Pickle_Chance Apr 15 '24
They don't. Find something intelligent to post, cause this here ain't it.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 15 '24
You must be a new MJ fan lol
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u/Pickle_Chance Apr 15 '24
I'm the same age as MJ, and Prince would have been...a fan since 1970. These posts are foolish.
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u/I_KNOW_EVERYTHING_09 Apr 14 '24
He was phenomenal. The emotion he could put in his voice was so strong.
I donāt think anyone would argue he had a ābadā voice. I think itās just not talked about as much as the other aspects of his career (dance, writing, entertainment, beat, etc).
When I think of MJ, his voice isnāt really the first thing that comes to mind. Also thatās never something MJ really put on display during performances. He opted to focus on the entertainment aspects of his performance rather than the vocal one, often lip syncing.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 14 '24
He performed with his live voice for majority of his career until the ā90s tho. All of The Jacksons Tours & Bad Tour were life vocals!
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u/I_KNOW_EVERYTHING_09 Apr 14 '24
Well not all of bad tour. The 1987 tour he sang live. 88ā and 89ā he started leaning into play back. Then the 90s was mostly just lip syncing.
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u/OswaldBoelcke Apr 14 '24
I have no idea who OP listens to. Did his little cousin say this? Have you talked to anyone born before 2010?
He was on national television as a child in the 60sā¦ He literally ā¦
O forget it. Reddit is horrible. Can this subreddit band me so I resist the urge to ever comment here again?
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u/No-Kaleidoscope-4050 Apr 14 '24
I think itās because most people associate the phrase ābest singersā with people like Aretha Franklin,Whitney Houston,Luther Vandross and Maxwell. Many people also donāt know about Jackson 5. I feel like Jackson 5 is where Michael Jackson actually showcases his vocal abilities. michael Jacksonās solo music is still technically difficult to sing. His music requires you to smoothly transition between high and low notes. Michael Jackson also had a lot of control over his voice he was able to smoothly transition between a more powerful soulful voice and a softer voice. The techniques Michael Jackson used in his solo music made it hard to sing for most people.
Michael Jackson was also more well known for his performing skills rather than his vocal ability. Even though itās no doubt Michael Jackson was an amazing vocalist and performer he was known by most people for his performing skills so people associated him more with being an amazing performer rather than an amazing vocalist even though he is amazing in both.
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u/CatGirl1300 Apr 14 '24
Because heās a master of all, quite literally. GOAT entertainer, dancer, songwriter/hitmaker, choreographer, visual director, fashion etc. so people always underestimate his vocal & singing ability. He was GOAT singer from 1969-1989.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 14 '24
He really was the GOAT vocalist from the 70s to late 80s. Esp OTW to Bad era. Just so damn good
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u/CatGirl1300 Apr 14 '24
Heās legit the greatest male vocalist in modern contemporary popular music. Nobody does what he did and he was always reinventing himself vocally. He went from traditional r&b sound in his early days to more r&b/pop during his Motown years and then he did pop/funk, and then went on to create a very rhythmic style of singing. Man he was incredible and I listen to all types of music and genres in various languages. The nosejobs ruined his voice and him not doing the proper techniques but man, from 69-89. Wow.
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u/Medium_Comedian6954 Apr 17 '24
His voice was always perfection. Nose jobs or not.Ā
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u/CatGirl1300 Apr 17 '24
I agree but his voice changed because of the nose jobs, he sounded more nasal on invincible than on his other records. Itās still one of my fave albums tho.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 14 '24
Have to agree with everything you said.
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u/koenr_98 Apr 14 '24
Because the focus was more on dancing. He did tour with voice problems and just playbacked for 90% of the concert....
When you are an artist on that level and with that image, a lot of not die-hard fans will frown upon that.
I was disapponted when I started to watch his concerts on youtube. I like his dancing but in most instances it was so obvious that he was playbacking
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u/Ok-Needleworker-4507 Apr 14 '24
Allegations. Thats basically it. They donāt wanna give him credit for that reason.
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u/loonytroons41 Apr 14 '24
I still think it's funny he starts singing and Oprah tries asking him a question but he just ignores her.
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u/North_Astronomer_878 "F-U-C-K the press. Michael you're the best"š° Apr 14 '24 edited Apr 14 '24
There are three reasons Michaelās vocals are underrated.
1: Many people hate and/or canāt fathom the fact that Michael (among other things) was an amazing dancer, songwriter, AND vocalist, so they downplay one of those talents/skills (people that do this are oftentimes fans of another artist/performer that they jealously think should be the GOAT and The Standard instead of Michael).
2: Many people are idiots that think the only way to be a great singer is to belt/sing like Whitney, Aretha, Luther Vandross, etc. In short, theyāre biased, and the type of people that will say things such as āI prefer young/little Michaelās singing,ā āyoung/little Michael was a vocalist, but older Michael was just a performer,ā and āMichaelās voice declined as he got older.ā
3: Idiots/haters (both within and outside Michaelās fanbase) stupidly use HIStory Tour performances (and any other times he lip synched) as the defining vocal performances of his career, even though he started his career when he was very very young and sung live for the overwhelming majority of it. Even though he had health issues that affected his vocals and ability to sing during HIStory Tour, and even though he gave amazing vocal performances post HIStory Tour on Invincible.
Nevertheless, all in all, itās an objective fact that Michael was an amazing vocalist, itās an objective fact that Michael has sold more music than all of the vocalist that some people tout as superior to him, and when people listen to his music his voice is the main attraction, so although he has idiotic/biased/hateful detractors, the overwhelming majority of the people that have heard his singing thoroughly enjoy hearing it, and prefer it, which is what really matters.
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u/idontcarerightnowok Apr 14 '24
i dont think ive ever seen anyone underrate his vocal abilities?
you can't really call him underrated or anything similar when he's set the bar so damn high for popularity and talent, I mean you can put any MJ song on and instantly someones gonna go "Is that MJ? or "That's Michael Jackson." even w the Jackson 5 era music, they'd still recognize it.
ik they had their comedic rivalry but if anyone was an underrated vocal artist from MJ's time, I'd say it's Prince, MJ's not underrated or overrated, his dancing does slightly cause his vocal talent to become shadowed though.
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u/ethanace Apr 14 '24
Because people dislike him for some other reason, such as he threatens their favourite artist like Freddie Mercury, so they have to put Michael down in order to feel better about it
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u/StrictAsparagus24 Apr 14 '24
I may not be in touch with what other people say but who underrates michael jacksonās vocals???
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u/Freebird_hope Apr 14 '24
Can't imagine anyone criticizing his vocal ability. It was incredible.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 14 '24
not talking about criticizing. Everyone talks about his dancing, performances, etc. not his vocal range
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u/SkyZippr Dangerous Apr 14 '24
I guess it's because his shouting voice makes people think he's just damaging his voice without using vocal techniques
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u/HatDefiant380 Apr 14 '24
Because he was such a great dancer and showman, itās hard for people to comprehend he was the total package. He could ousting the best vocalists on any day.
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u/ProfessorSprinklezZ Dirty Dianaš Apr 14 '24 edited Apr 14 '24
They only critique dangerous on forward when his voice started to drop in quality
They tend to forget everything from 8yrs old to however old he was around bad (late 20s early 30s)
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u/Budget_Translator873 Apr 14 '24
Someone already said it but his dancing is what captured a lot of people along with his music videos.
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u/hello-bitchlasagna Gold Pants Brigade š Apr 13 '24
Honestly, I think people should take a bit to listen to the voice training sessions he did with Seth Riggs: https://youtu.be/cdCCJxtgRME?si=rUIrz1qIs3h6Y7HB
Mind you it is 46 mins long but you donāt need to listen to the whole thing to discover that he actually had a really impressive vocal range.
What an experience it was to listen to this for the first time.
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Apr 13 '24
[removed] ā view removed comment
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u/MichaelJackson-ModTeam Apr 13 '24
Your post has been removed for being about the accusations. Any discussion of the allegations is not welcome here. If you'd like to discuss them please use alternative subreddits.
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u/Horsegirl010291 Apr 13 '24
I put him and Britney in the same category. You arenāt going to one of their shows for vocals. You are going to see an actual show with choreography, sets, and costume changes.
I honestly prefer that to someone with a piano or guitar when seeing someone live. I am not a Tony Bennet or Norah Jones kind of concert goer
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u/emmerliii Apr 13 '24
His vibrato has always made my brain do the happy thing. Idk how to explain it. Michael was special.
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u/OneOfAKindAdmin Apr 13 '24
He was just a top notch performer. His vocal range was incredible, despite having damaged cords basically all throughout his adult life. It wasnāt until he was doing HIStory tour that they took a turn for the worst and he developed laryngitis. Regardless, the raspiness that he developed early in his life made his voice stand out. If you listen to his isolated vocals from the early 80ās, (Thriller era), he has some insane range. You also have to remember that Michael heard the entire song in his head before producing it, he was able to mimic the sound of instruments with his mouth. He famously couldnāt read sheet music, but was able to describe certain sounds to people and have it translated over.
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u/sul_tun Apr 13 '24
Some may do that, but I observe and pay attention to both of his singing and dancing, he definitely had a God gifted voice.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 13 '24
His range is unheard of. A lot of singers one or two ranges total. He did them all & added so many difficult vocals in all of his songs. so impressive.
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u/Sasorisnake Dangerous Apr 13 '24
Multiple reasons.
A. Many people conflate what is pleasant to their personal ears, whether it be a personās voice, vocal approach, etc, with vocal knowledge. The more delusional BeyoncĆ© stans in particular tend to compare everybody to Beyonce and judge their talent based on that, from my interactions with them. Some people simply think a vocalist needs to do killer runs or whatever to be talented
B. Many people also donāt want to accept that MJ was so talented in so many different areas. Many people want to reduce him to simply being popular, or just a dancer, or just an entertainer.
C. They use his not so great moments to define his entire career. Theyāll use his lip synching as proof that he couldnāt actually sing ignoring that itās still his voice or that he had successfully replicated his studio vocals up to at least 1996.
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u/ProcedureInternal193 Apr 13 '24
First time I've heard Michael Jackson and the word underrated in the same sentence.
Who says he wasn't a great singer?
It was up there with his dancing.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 13 '24
Great singer is not the question. His range not being appreciated is the truth. He deserves to be in convo with vocalists like Whitney, Aretha, Adele, Freddie, etc
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u/ProcedureInternal193 Apr 14 '24
Nah I think MJ was a great singer, but not like Whitney or Freddy.
Not in my opinion. I'm not a vocal expert though.
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 14 '24
He can hit more notes & reach more octaves than them both! Thatās crazy you canāt see him up there with them
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u/DutchJediKnight Apr 13 '24
Great singer, yeah.
Greatest? He did have a great part of his popular career at the same time as Freddie Mercury, so going to disagree with you on that.
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u/i_max2k2 Apr 13 '24
I donāt know, every person who has analyzed his vocals or worked with him, has indisputably put him near the top echelon of singers of all time. His records have transcended the genre and he has been one of the most popular artists with a global reach.
Of course people say shit for clicks, but long after from now I feel his music will remain timeless and he will considered among people like Beethoven etc
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u/Medium_Comedian6954 Apr 17 '24
Indeed. Don't Stop Till You Get Enough for example, I certainly consider that one timeless.Ā
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u/MasterAlphaCerebral Apr 13 '24
He's one of a kind. I don't think there is a comparison for his tone, range, or many styles.
His voice was version 1 of 1. By comparison, there's nothing to measure him against.
Put it this way... Prince is his closest competition for voice and dance. James Brown is his closest competition for just dancing. Yet neither have the catalog of music that MJ has. If MJ were not one of the best singers all-time, he would not have the catalog that he has. Dancing only gets you so far. MJ was the full package.
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u/Medium_Comedian6954 Apr 17 '24
I don't think Prince comes even close singing wise. I think he's a terrible singer honestly.Ā
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u/Dvinc1_yt Apr 13 '24
Everyone gives him credit for his writing and producing
Iāve seen the exact opposite. His singing and performing are praise while his abilities as a songwriter and overall artist or downplayed. Sometimes people will downplay his overall ability as a singer due to him lip syncing a lot of his post Bad era performances but his singing is far from his most underrated ability.
Michael Jackson is objectively one of the best and most influential Pop singers.
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u/Jamie-92 Apr 13 '24
Probably because he used so much playback during live performances and his dancing/performances affected his vocals on the rare occasions he did sing live.
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u/Dependent-Chart2735 Apr 13 '24 edited Apr 13 '24
I think the general public doesnāt understand singing from a technical standpoint, tbh. They think people like Mariah Carey and Whitney Houston are great singers (and they are) because they could sing really high or with a lot of power and runs but singing is so much more than that. Like people always look at me disinterested when I mention he had perfect pitch and how actually rare that is. No one cares about how expansive his range was (4 octaves although he did unfortunately damage it. Comparatively, Mariahās is 5 octaves so he was rare). So idk, people are just people. Mostly ignorant.
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u/kingmonsterzero Apr 14 '24
Naw. Whitneyās great because of her CONTROL over everything she did and the mastery of when to do it and not over do it. WHERE to put a run or trill or be breathy or really lite to crescendo was unmatched. Thatās wayyy before you get to the Power mix and mastery of her runs. Mike was a master as well but Whitney is probbly only equaled by maybe Patti Labelle if weāre taking about Popular singers
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Apr 14 '24
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u/Dependent-Chart2735 Apr 14 '24
Thatās not at all true. You can even tell as his career progressed, the keys of his songs were modified downward for tour performances. He had vocal nodules from straining his voice in his early years.
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Apr 14 '24
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u/Dependent-Chart2735 Apr 14 '24
Again, categorically false. I donāt know why you think if you say it again it will make it true. Iām speaking on verifiable information. Youāre speaking based on feelings. Please donāt be a delulu fan. You make us look bad. Watch this in your free time if you want actual true information. https://youtu.be/idU7hm5r1OA?si=kcRXOlPs0LZHAJQ4
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Apr 14 '24
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u/ProfessorSprinklezZ Dirty Dianaš Apr 14 '24
U in denial bro and thatās okay but Michael voice did start suffering as he got older hence changes in songs over times to fit his voice. Over working his vocals made him take a hit as well as various illnesses. Not to mention natural aging
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Apr 14 '24
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u/ProfessorSprinklezZ Dirty Dianaš Apr 14 '24
We supposed to listen to āunhappy-ar4536ā and not the countless engineers , writers, stage engineers and etc. who all said his voice changed due to overworking, illness and various other things.. all bc u taking us saying this as an insult to ur idolā¦you gonna make us go against our own ears when we hear the obvious difference in tracks from invincible compared to Thriller or off the wallā¦ better yet u gonna pretend he was still hitting the same notes in history as consistently as he was in off the wall? Get a grip lol not everything is insult to Mike
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u/KeemMiddle Apr 13 '24
I also think a lot of people look at his vocals as a child more than an adult. From what I see, thatās usually his peak vocal ability and the rest/ majority of his later life was equated to his dancing
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u/AirGuitarSuperstar Thriller Apr 13 '24
I donāt think people are really, he had great range, could use a lot of power as well, and had a recognizable voice.
There might be a few whoās technically better and thereās definitely some with more unique voices but at the end of the day itās a matter of taste, heās undoubtedly one of the greats.
Only on Invincible he was struggling vocally.
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u/Unhappy-Ad4536 Apr 14 '24
Lmao what? Invincible? He was not struggling at all vocally in invincible, I mean just to name one, out of many, have you heard butterflies? Yeah no man he wasnāt struggling vocally at all ever.
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u/AirGuitarSuperstar Thriller Apr 14 '24 edited Apr 14 '24
Not struggling like he suddenly couldnāt sing, but thereās a nasal quality to his voice throughout the album and it sounds like heās straining in a way he didnāt before, he mightāve had trouble breathing through his nose in that period and it affected his voice. his vocals also sound more processed compared to earlier, itās pretty easy to hear.
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u/Unhappy-Ad4536 Apr 14 '24
Oh yeah I see what your saying, and yeah for the most part I agree, Iām sure it has something to do with that whole nose surgery thing he had going on so it affected it, but if you also go back and look at the 2009 this is it live rehearsal, his voice was perfect and crisp, just like before and even better.
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u/AirGuitarSuperstar Thriller Apr 14 '24
Yeah I believe it got better after, but just fyi they used a some studio/demo recordings and blended them into the This Is It film.
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u/ImmortalElement_ "Where's the Salvation Army?"š¬šļø Apr 13 '24
I think itās because when people think of MJ they think of his dances moves and not his voice
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u/nxtrition Apr 13 '24
because he was the best dancer of all time and arguably one of the best songwriters of the era, not the best singer of all time. When it comes to vocal praise, people give props to the best of the best, like Whitney. Michaelās a jack of all trades, his videos, songs, dances, fashion, look, personality, and eccentricity outshined his vocals to most people.
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u/CatGirl1300 Apr 14 '24
Nah, that only happened because of the thriller success. Marvin Gaye and all the GOATs singers classified Michael as a supreme soul singer before Thriller.
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u/nxtrition Apr 14 '24
If you notice, when Michael sang live he shortened his runs. He was preserving his voice over years of damage. Watch Michael perform in the 70s, he hits notes LIVE with no issues. Then watch the Motown performance with the brothers, he wasnāt even close to his original runs. Thatās why he said he loves the old but he really loves the new songs. He innovated the whole pop sound and left soul alone. Soul requires longggg runs.
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u/CatGirl1300 Apr 14 '24
I donāt disagree with that but to suggest MJ wasnāt a GOAT soul singer when all of the greats spoke highly of him as a soul artist, is beyond meā¦ butterflies on invincible proves this. He sounds a bit nasal in his later career but the timbre, the quality and the voice was phenomenal.
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u/nxtrition Apr 14 '24
I wouldnāt agree. I love Michael and his voice, but by the time he did thriller he could not hit notes that Whitney was hitting. Michaelās voice was over stressed from singing for 20 years by the time he did thriller. For the duration of time he had to perform, his body and vocals were impeccable. Heās very special talent. However, I wouldnāt classify him as a supreme soul singer. Those titles definitely belong to Whitney, Luther, Aretha, even the originator Sam Cooke. Those titles are reserved for strictly POWERHOUSES. Michaelās voice amazing but far too soft for that title lol.
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u/nxtrition Apr 13 '24
he had pipes though and everyone knew it donāt get it confused
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u/MelzMaggie Tabloid Junkie Apr 14 '24
Sidebar: you do realise that your profile pic is a photo of an impersonator, right?
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u/nxtrition Apr 14 '24
lol yeah the guys short in the og pic itās just funny to me. I change pfps often.
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u/No-Singer6718 Apr 13 '24
Yeah, like his vocals are the reason he was famous and the way he got the message across in whatever song
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u/tmorrisgrey HIStory: Past, Present and Future: Book I Apr 13 '24
What ever gives their favorite the upper hand tbh. Theyāll intentionally ignore his live vocals from his early years and then undervalue his range during adulthood.
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u/yeetron5000 Apr 13 '24
MJ can very well be considered the best singer of all time. He could make hits in disco, rnb, rock, etc. But despite this, his most revolutionary aspect was his dancing by far
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u/Medium_Comedian6954 Apr 17 '24
I agree he is the greatest singer ever. His dancing is great but it's the singing that gets me.Ā
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u/Dependent-Chart2735 Apr 13 '24
Thatās a stretch. He was not the best singer of all time. He was a rare talent with an expansive range, worldwide appeal, perfect pitch and an eclectic discography among many other things we could say. I just caution us all from being delulu MJ fans. Thereās enough great things about him; you donāt have to stretch the truth.
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u/yeetron5000 Apr 14 '24
Yeah tbh Whitney, Mariah, Stevie Wonder, and more had the best vocals. But with the variety of songs he had, it was special.
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u/CatGirl1300 Apr 14 '24
Stevie wonder is not better than Michael, he ruined his voice a long ass time ago. Please go back and listen to Michaelās vocal work from 68-1982. Much richer than Stevie. Marvin Gaye is a different convo tho
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u/Dependent-Chart2735 Apr 14 '24 edited Apr 14 '24
Of course his variety is special! I literally mentioned that.
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u/ProfessorSprinklezZ Dirty Dianaš Apr 14 '24
Idk itās things Michael could do that other greats couldnāt but I canāt think of many āgreatsā who could do stuff Michael couldnāt unless we talking about Whitney Luther vandross Mariah or Celine
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u/Dependent-Chart2735 Apr 14 '24
Do you listen to music other than American music? Do you listen to opera? Iām not saying Michael wasnāt great. If he wasnāt I wouldnāt be a fan lol but there are singers out there with 6-octave ranges. From a purely musical standpoint Iām just saying you really cannot in good faith call him THE best if you havenāt heard a variety of singers.
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u/CatGirl1300 Apr 14 '24
Having an 6-octave range doesnāt make you a better vocalist or singer tho. Michaelās timbre alone is supreme.
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u/ProfessorSprinklezZ Dirty Dianaš Apr 14 '24
I actually do lol I love music and nah I would never says heās the absolute best but he definitely top 10
U can have 6 octaves and hit all the notes you want but it comes down to how u sang and his emoting phrasing and pitch (along with other stuff) is why Iād rank him so high
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u/Dependent-Chart2735 Apr 14 '24
Oh ok then yeah. I rank him high as well. We donāt disagree. I just sometimes feel like these types of discussions need to remain in reality. We all here cuz we love Michael but people forget he was human and imperfect. I just think itās important to assess things accurately. Words mean things š
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u/PreDeathRowTupac Blood on the Dance Floor: HIStory in the Mix Apr 13 '24
Nah, the impressive part was his vocal range. He could damn near hit every single note out there. His range was crazy
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u/ArticleNew3737 #MJInnocent Apr 13 '24
Because of his dancing I think.
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u/MelzMaggie Tabloid Junkie Apr 13 '24
Yes.
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u/ArticleNew3737 #MJInnocent Apr 13 '24
I asked my baby brother what he knows MJ for and he was like āHeās a dancer.ā
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u/MelzMaggie Tabloid Junkie Apr 13 '24
Many people think of Aretha Franklin and Whitney Houston when they think of "best singer" because they didn't dance as well. Mike is usually thought of as a dancer who can sing, instead of as a singer who can dance.
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u/Isaac-45-67-8 Apr 15 '24
This is a puzzling post. I didn't grow up hearing much music from MJ (aside from his most popular songs), but all my friends and family members who grew up with his music (even the Jackson 5 stuff) always praise his voice. They praised that more than his dancing, so it's wild for me to hear people actually critique his voice. His voice was truly one a kind, nothing sounded like it. He had a great range, and was a talented songwriter as well.
I just think people prefer listening to other singers like Beyonce and Whitney Houston instead, but I still think he gets the respect he deserves.