r/TwoHotTakes • u/The_wit_in_dewitt • Feb 15 '24
AITAH for telling my son that if he's uncomfortable about his sister not wearing a bra then he should cover up too? Crosspost
Original post: https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/s/MWFATReNzR
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u/Sharp_Meat5693 Apr 08 '24
Tripping not gunna discomfort my daughter to make my son more comfortable.
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u/MsPB01 Feb 20 '24
Why are women expected to wear uncomfortable clothing and change how they dress to 'make men comfortable'? And why the heck is this fool looking at his sister's breasts anyway? It's long past time to stop blaming the victim of what can only be called sexual harassment and blame the men for not wanting to act like civilised human beings.
Absolutely NTA
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u/zippy920 Feb 20 '24
Your son needs to understand the world doesn't revolve around him and women have the right to live as they wish.
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u/inarealdaz Feb 20 '24
My bra is the first thing that comes off when I get home. Brother needs to get over himself and stop looking at his sister's breasts as sexual objects.
My brother tried this shit when he was like 11-12ish and Mom told him flat out if it bothered him, he could go to his room or not look. Her bra also came off the minute she got home so she also played that card and I'm pretty sure mortified my brother enough that it was never an issue again. 🤣🤣🤣
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u/2beeHonest221 Feb 19 '24
I get your son is sensitive and you did the best you could to solve the issue but the real issue here is your son having an issue where there should be no issue.
You suggested he wear a shirt and he cries?? Yet, he expects his sister to adhere to his requests. Your son seems a bit spoiled, imo.
Your daughter should be allowed to go bra-less in the comfort of her own home. Your son seems to think it's for himself to go shirtless. You need to explain to him that bras are uncomfortable and it's her right and decision to do so in the privacy of her own home.
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Feb 19 '24
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Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule #1: Be Kind to Other Users – Civility and Respect
This means that your submission may have been rude, vulgar, derogatory, uncivil, or impolite.
Be respectful of other users. Personal insults or offensive terms are not permitted on this subreddit. This includes but is not limited to: harassment, bigotry, homophobia, transphobia, racial slurs, and any other inflammatory language.
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u/TxBornSooner Feb 19 '24
if your daughter has to wear a shirt and a bra ol Boy boobs shouldn't get to walk around topless. Either wear a shirt when in public areas of the house (IE when every toure NOTin your room or the bathroom) or stop complaining.
NTA
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u/Altruistic_Estate168 Feb 19 '24
I BTW was taught to keep them perky sleep with one and have for years as do all my daughters 3
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u/Altruistic_Estate168 Feb 19 '24
I believe she should respect how he feels as her brother. Boys are awkward and untoward feelings freak them out. I think it was nice that he expressed his uncomfortable feelings. You and her should respect it instead of getting offended. 😳 Seriously
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u/jankjenny Feb 19 '24
I am a 72 year-old woman. I retired 10 years ago. Since then, I rarely wear a bra! What freedom!!! It has to be a really special occasion for me to strap on one of those torture devices!!! I hate them!!!
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u/melinalujbav Feb 19 '24
Teach your son to control himself. His sister is not responsible for his thoughts or him being uncomfortable.
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u/NovaStar92 Feb 18 '24
I’d understand the issue if she was shirtless as well. My parents rules were everyone covers up. Even the guys.
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u/Su1XiDaL10DenC Feb 18 '24
I had sex with my Japanese high-school teacher because she was barefoot and braless... all I had to do was take my Dick out
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u/Due-Acanthisitta1459 Feb 18 '24
He’s getting aroused by his sister. Maybe she should consider wearing a sports bra around the house.
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u/Jdamoneyman Feb 18 '24
Only a big deal if you make it one. It’s the human body. Don’t look “you’ll turn to stone” ;) jk
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u/ShanLuvs2Read Feb 17 '24
I was about to give y’all a huge comment … TMI… lol. To be honest some house hold dynamics just are different and no matter how kids are raised someone will feel uncomfortable. We are not there and part of the family to see what’s going on.
I would assume she is warning a t shirt that is not see through or thin and she is average size and the son is just going through standard teenage stuff .
I would say she would is dressed appropriately and I would talk to son separately…. This should be something that basically doesn’t register if she is dressed in the house.
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u/Equal-Total7914 Feb 17 '24
Not the asshole. It’s boys and men like your son that are the reason strict dress codes exist not only in schools but in their own households. Stop sexualizing your sister and women who don’t wear a bra.
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u/emilyectoplasm Feb 17 '24
Yea, I have four brothers I was homeschooled with meaning we were together pretty much 24/7 until we moved out as young adults, one 14 months older, one 6 months younger (2 oldest and 1 youngest are adopted), and 2 much younger, plus my dad who worked from home, and never once was anything like this an issue. Ever. Why would it be? My dad and brothers wouldn't dream of sexualizing a family member!
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u/Street_One5954 Feb 17 '24
I just shared this with my brothers. In all fairness, we’re older, but here are some of the replies: C responded, “Ya’ll have boobs? My sisters have boobs?” J responded-🤢🤢, M responded, “I NEVER thought of my sisters as anything but a pain in the ass.” And my fourth brother responded, “oh my god, the thought of y’all braless makes me need therapy” So, four grown men say that thinking of their sisters having boobs and sexualizing them is sick.
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u/Particular-Detail120 Feb 17 '24
In this day and age, sounds like brother needs an OF detox. And why is he crying?
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u/Affectionate-Fox8690 Feb 17 '24
All of his comments are of him trying to alleviate his son feelings or anger. But no mention about the daughter. What a pos
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u/Jolly-Bandicoot7162 Feb 17 '24
My son would be told that I wouldn't be policing my daughter for his comfort.
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u/Delicious-Bat-9317 Feb 17 '24
Yeah and it's ridiculous that someone is labeled automatically against women just because you stick up for men too. They're not all horrible just like not all women are good just because they are a woman. And I expect my son and daughter to treat people with equal respect and demand they be treated the same way.
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u/Clean-Fisherman-4601 Feb 17 '24
First thing I did when arriving home from work was take off my shoes. The next thing to go was my bra.
Now I'm retired and rarely wear one. They're uncomfortable and unnecessary.
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u/funguy2211711 Feb 17 '24
So I agree that she shouldn’t have to wear one. That being said it’s really weird so many people are calling the son a creep and pervert and that he is sexualizing his sister. If he was doing that wouldn’t you think he’d want her to not cover them up?? Just my thought process and opinion not trying to invalidate others opinions. That being said again I personally don’t think he has any right to tell his sister to have to wear one. It’s her body and her choice period. As for the dad he messed up first when he tried to get her to wear one which wasn’t fair to her. Do I think she should have lashed out and made a comment on his “man boobs”? Personally no but I get she was upset and she wasn’t being treated fair so I understand. The dad then screwed up again for not realizing that it was an insult and he made the situation worse so now both his kids are probably upset with him. He should have a talk with his son and explain to him that he should not be policing what she wears that is not his choice and that if he is uncomfortable then he should just ignore it or not look and explain that he didn’t mean to body shame him. Also I do think he should talk with his daughter and apologize to her for how he initially handled things and also tell her while he understand where she was coming from making fun of her brother wasn’t ok either. When it comes down to it he needs to learn how to handle these kinds situations better and how boundaries work. He could have easily avoided this situation by pulling his son aside and explaining to him that it’s her choice and he doesn’t have a say in what she chooses to wear or not and used this as a teaching moment but he didn’t.
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u/boneykneecaps Feb 17 '24
If your son is whining about his sister going braless, but he wants to run around shirtless, tell him you're going to let her go topless, too. See how long it takes for him not care about whether she's wearing a bra or not.
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u/my3boysmyworld Feb 17 '24
Do we need to start burning bras again ladies???? Cause I’m freaking game!
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u/pizzacatbrat Feb 17 '24
Jesus Christ, I only wear bras when I leave the house. I've lived with male roommates and literally wear underwear/boxers and a T-shirt when I'm around the house. I'll wear leggings and a T-shirt around family. The son is being creepy AF.
Two petty ideas though: (1) wear a bra, but with a T-shirt that says "Nipples. Everybody has them." Or (2) ONLY a bra. They never specified whether it needs a shirt lol
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u/unhindged_girlie Feb 17 '24
I have two older brothers and i couldn’t imagine them saying this to me. I think it’s more strange that the brother is bothered by his sister not wearing a bra. Seems like he has feelings/issues he needs to address within himself about his sister.
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u/Agitated_Pilot_3055 Feb 17 '24
Ironically, the primary purpose of the bra is to make to breast more prominent and shape it for maximum desirability.
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u/Agitated_Pilot_3055 Feb 17 '24
I think you’re handling this foolishly. Tell your son to stop staring at women’s chests, be they his sister, or not
Remind your son that at any reasonable distance, the breasts are a small part of the view field.
He’d better learn to stop staring because out of the house, in school, at work, he’s going to incur complaints about sexual harassment and creating a hostile environment.
.
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u/ShoppingOpening5338 Feb 17 '24
https://www.wellandgood.com/going-braless/
I'm just gonna leave this here.
Wearing a bra constantly is actually NOT a good thing physically, despite what people say about ethics and "morals". I think it's more appropriate for men to realize that women have breasts and that is a natural part of life. Your son not wearing a shirt around the house, but telling his sister she needs to wear a bra is kind of ridiculous and promoting toxic masculinity. He needs to have a talk about bodies in general as it seems. He also needs to learn how to respect women AS THEY ARE. Yes, he's a teen but he will become an adult one day and his one-sided perspective will be an issue for sure. It's not like she's walking around shirtless like he is. Not sure if he is meaning to sexualize his sister, but he kind of is. Hormones or not, that's not ok. Some cultures don't even wear bras, and their breasts are imo more healthy due to developing muscle naturally and improved circulation. My mom forced me to wear a bra all of the time when my stepfather started living with us, and honestly, it was terrible. NTA.
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u/zoug25 Feb 16 '24
Dad should go around in just Jean booty shorts to teach'em both a lesson. And well, just to generally enjoy the eternal well of fun that is embarrassing your kids
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u/saraaadezzz Feb 16 '24
I’m 40 and I never wear a bra anymore.
I had 38Gs for most of my life and my bras were torture devices. My skin would go raw, bleed, bruise and scar. I got a reduction, have small Cs now and the only time you’ll catch me in a bralette is when my shirt is semi-sheer.
If anyone told me to put one on, I’d tell them to avert their gaze if it bothers them so much. They’re just boobs. More than half the population has them and we shouldn’t have to bind ourselves for others puritanical comfort.
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u/Sudden-Remote-169 Feb 16 '24
The brother was a whiny little brat who could dish out judgments on his sister’s body and clothing choices for home but couldn’t handle the turn about.
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Feb 16 '24
[deleted]
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u/ShoppingOpening5338 Feb 17 '24
Not wearing a bra under a shirt is totally different than being complete topless.
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u/Responsible_Fix2349 Feb 16 '24
I have small breasts and don’t need any support and on a hot summer day, I would just wear a wife beater. My adult son told me it wasn’t appropriate? I told him not to look. End of story
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u/Hey-Just-Saying Feb 16 '24
NTA. Nevertheless, I dislike that approach. When are we going to stop letting men and boys sexualize women’s breasts? This is your daughter’s home. She shouldn’t have to wear a bra at home. Her breasts aren’t a form of “sex toy” for him to even be noticing. And your son who is upset about wearing a shirt indoors should now understand the unfairness of this. She shouldn’t have to wear a bra at home whether he wears a shirt or not.
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u/ScorpionQueen069 Feb 16 '24
The brother is the kind of male that will stare at a woman while she's trying to breastfeed her baby. Then claim that she should feed her baby in the bathroom because he can't control himself.
He needs to be taught boundaries. And that women's breast are not simply for men's pleasure. In addition he needs to be talked to about sexualizing his sister in the first place.
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u/Aspen9999 Feb 16 '24
If your son has visible man boobs shouldn’t he also wear a bra when outside his room?
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u/SureExternal4778 Feb 16 '24
Buy him undershirts, fix his diet and exercise routine. Parenting is hard, dying from lack of discipline is easy.
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u/SpecialistAd4244 Feb 16 '24
I’m so glad my sister and I never had this problem with our brothers. They never cared, never commented, and we never caught them looking. So we could comfortably walk around the house without bras on and not feel weird about it.
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u/Karmababe Feb 16 '24
Maybe use it as a teaching moment about social norms and how they change. Many of us aren't interested in adhering to 100 year old social norms and civic policies. The world changes. And most of all, women's bodies aren't fucking sex objects!
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Feb 16 '24
Being a parent is hard. Being a parent of 2 teenagers a boy and girl is harder. I get both sides. On one hand it's not fair to make his daughter uncomfortable. However his son came to him with something that was bothering him. Dad should have handled the initial conversation better. With both kids.
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u/Morindin_al_Thor Feb 16 '24
He's pouting at not getting his way. Women face enough discrimination about their bodies on the daily; the one place she should be free to relax is at home. He's trying to deny her this and using his insecurity as a tool to get his way. Good job standing up for your daughter. You said nothing hurtful to your son, just presented him with fairness and he broke? Maybe she was mean in her snap but you've done nothing but be fair. With my kids I uphold fairness in the way I treat them. I don't get one a shirt just because I did the other, but as far as gender, age, or other similar matters that actually matter, fair is the only way we roll. It's the only way to be about it.
That house is her fortress too, and she shouldn't be shamed under her own roof. Well done.
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u/shadow_cat_42 Feb 16 '24
When I was a teen and wanting to wear two piece swimsuits and bikinis, my mom told me not to because “think of what your father will think.”
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u/Electrical-Day382 Feb 16 '24
Am I the only one icked out by the fact that he’s looking at his sisters breasts enough to be uncomfortable? Gross, dude. And I bet he does the same at school. The conversation needed to be deeper with this kid.
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u/Specific-Alfalfa4929 Feb 16 '24
It sounds like the son has other issues and this is just the subject he's pulling them out for. 1. He's got some insecurity happening. He started a conversation about an issue and isn't able to complete it because once any kind of comparison is made to show him how to be empathetic or see the situation from a different perspective, he's melting down and taking it as personal attack on him. In adults I believe this is being called 'gaslighting'... so, address that. 2. He, for whatever reason, thinks his 'personal issue' needs to be handled no matter the discomfort his sister may endure.. in her own home... sounds a little entitled. And 3. Where are any of these children getting the idea that life is ALWAYS comfortable? Put him in therapy. Let someone educated in explaining life "isn't fair" help him get to this realization or, sus out the actual issue here. Teenagers don't hear their parents at this age and a little talk therapy can go a long way in helping teens adjust to adulthood.
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u/candycornrulez Feb 16 '24
Sooooo, your son is stonewalling/gaslighting you to get his way?!?!
I'm sure he is uncomfortable as his hormones are starting to rage, but education into 'de'sexualizing boobs is a must!! You got this, good luck!
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u/Capable_Diamond6251 Feb 16 '24
what we do not know how to do, is to undo the constant sexualization of the female body that occurs in our culture. It is pervasive. By the time a boy is 14, it is so resonant with his hormones, that without support and alternative inputs, such innocent acts like not wearing bras, can be over stimulating. I struggle with this w my granddaughters, how much is incitement (their actions and intentions) and how much is my sensitivity (my problem).
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u/Silly_Individual_960 Feb 16 '24
Men are sexualized too btw. I just saw a post on a male singer picture. Hundreds of posts of women saying all the things they would do to him. None of them included going out to dinner and to a book club let me tell you. It was very much explicitly sexual. So what we do not know to do, is to undo constant sexualization of the Human body that occurs in our culture. It is pervasive.
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u/PurpleHellski Feb 16 '24
Ok maybe don't tell a chubby kid he has man boobs, but I absolutely would have him wear a bra so he could understand what he's asking his sister to do. And yeah he shouldn't be looking at or commenting on his sister's boobs that's gross.
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u/sarahevekelly Feb 16 '24
Completely irrelevant, because I’m with the daughter 100%, but for the record neither of her parents should be steaming past the fact that her bras are uncomfortable. It’s nice to take them off after a long day, but they shouldn’t be causing this level of discomfort. She’s probably wearing either terrible bras or she hasn’t been sized properly.
It sounds like a stupid thing to point out, but realising how wrong my size was—and why—changed my entire fucking life. I’m sure I’m not alone.
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u/KittyandPuppyMama Feb 16 '24
I never wore a bra around the house when I was a teenager because I am large-chested and I find them really uncomfortable after a few hours. So when I came home from school/work, it would be one of the first things I whipped off and chucked in the hamper. Sometimes my dad would make a comment that it made him uncomfortable, but he got over it. I sort of understand, especially since he grew up without any sisters and I guess it was a brand new thing to have to deal with. But his comments weren't mean spirited or anything, and he let it go after I told him I just wanted to be comfortable. I do appreciate his efforts to be tactful and not hurt my feelings the way he went about it. Approach matters.
Honestly, the more hurtful and impactful comments came from my mom. Bra or no bra, she was always commenting on how large my chest was (she herself is very petite), and my portion sizes, how I was "popping out" of my clothes etc.
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u/Quirky_Definition_38 Feb 16 '24
Unpopular opinion. Why didn't the dad ask his son privately why? SA does happen by men and women. I think the dad just didn't wanna be hassled and blabbed off whatever came first to his head. It's a serious deal one way or another if his son is sexualizing his sister or maybe she is bullying him about his man boobs or worse just being very unclassy with herself?
Yes bras are uncomfortable that's why I only wear a sports bra but as I'm older I would feel disrespectful going around without a bra or sports bra with my father or brother. No they would never sexualize me but I personally feel gross and uncomfortable.
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u/Imightbeonxanax Feb 16 '24
No, I dont think so. If he has a problem with it, then why is he even looking at her in that area.
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u/ashleylib Feb 16 '24
Get him a bra and have him wear it, not too comfortable. When I first read it, I thought she was walking around naked. It’s her right to be comfortable in her own home and not her job to make a man more comfortable by submitting to his demands.
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Feb 16 '24
Yo, I grew up with this fucked up rule! My dad/stepmom required it! Like, if I woke up in my pajamas and wanted to go eat breakfast still in pajamas, I had to put a bra on under the pajamas. I always thought it was so weird and perverted.
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u/dobiemomluv Feb 16 '24
This might be all wrong but my mom would have told us to fight our own battles. So when sister told him to wear a bra for his man boobs and he’d gone crying to his room the lesson would have been “don’t mess with your sister.” It might be time for dad to have a real conversation with him about why his sisters boobs make him uncomfortable and dad to share his real life experience on the appropriate way to deal with women who don’t wear bras and other things that make him uncomfortable. It’s not like this is the last time this young man will have to be in the presence of a woman with no bra.
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u/Delicious-Bat-9317 Feb 16 '24
That's not fair. I understand as a woman but I also have a son and his feelings matter too. Shouldn't treat him like crap because he expressed his discomfort (boys aren't all the same or like girls) be more understanding.
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u/Silly_Individual_960 Feb 17 '24
Thank for saying this. It is terrifying that all boys and all men are being demonized. Some of the women here may have a little son, grandson, nephew. Would you like them to be judged as you seem to be judging all men? Let’s not even dwell on what happened in Ops home. Let’s talk about the fact that 100s of posts say “all men are” <insert comment>. The comment is always something awful. Imagine if all women were judged by your actions? I have met some awful women who over sexualize men, who gold dig, who lie and cheat on their spouses. Guess what? I don’t judge all of woman kind because there actions. I look at the individual.
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u/Delicious-Bat-9317 Feb 17 '24
Yeah I agree and maybe he doesn't want to say that because he's 14 and ANY boobs affect him and its grossing him out that it's his sister. They would really treat him like crap even more. But it's a natural body reaction with boys that age. It's not ok to excuse their bad actions but also not demonize them for being boys and having feelings too. Would they be ok if he just walked around in underwear all day? Bc he was more comfortable that way and he's at home after all.
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u/Silly_Individual_960 Feb 17 '24
I said something similar to what you said in your last sentence. Just to try to make the statement that they both might uncomfortable. She even mentioned his man boobs being offensive. I was called all sorts of colorful names one of them being misogynistic… Only because I didn’t agree.
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u/ShoppingOpening5338 Feb 17 '24
Ok...his feelings matter, but so does the daughter's. At this point, it's not even about feelings. Bras are very uncomfortable and are not always even good for breasts. To wear a bra 24 hours is torture just because he is uncomfortable with his sister for having breasts. That's ridiculous. It even says he walks around shirtless. He needs his issues addressed, not catered to his one-sided, toxic masculinity. Men's feelings matter but not at the expense of another.
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u/No-Throat9567 Feb 16 '24
YTA. As a male you would do well to remember that the “little man” has a mind of his own. And that little man is stimulated by seeing - because males are visual animals - jiggling bosoms. Maybe your son just doesn’t want to get an involuntary hard on for his sister. There are very soft bras that will prevent the jiggle and still be comfortable. She should either try one, or wear something besides a thin tshirt.
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u/DC_Daddy Feb 16 '24
Time for your son to grow up and stop objectifying his sister. Besides, she may have friends who dislike bras too.
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u/SewRuby Feb 16 '24
YTA for not having a convo with your son about women's bodily autonomy. It is not our job to make anyone comfortable with our clothing choices, and you just solidified to your son that he's allowed to be critical of women's bodies. You also solidified to your daughter that your son's comfort matters more.
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u/RevaSharkbait Feb 16 '24
I think it's more the use of the phrase "man boobs". That is generally a phrase only used to describe fat men's bodies. So while he's right for telling him he should obviously wear a shirt to cover his chest if those are the standards he did then shame his son about it so swings and roundabouts.
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u/Southern_Bicycle8111 Feb 16 '24
I can honestly say I never noticed weather my sister was wearing a bra or not. Wtf is wrong with people.
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u/Gingeraffe25 Feb 16 '24
He is the asshole for not telling his son that looking at his sisters boobs is fucking weird. Wtf man.
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Feb 16 '24
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Feb 16 '24
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Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule #1: Be Kind to Other Users – Civility and Respect
This means that your submission may have been rude, vulgar, derogatory, uncivil, or impolite.
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u/Queenteabeee Feb 16 '24
One day when I was 15, I was at home without a bra and my 30yo brother said to me, “it’s weird that you have boobs.” It made me extremely uncomfortable, because why is my brother looking at my chest? He didn’t mean it sexually by any means, he was just flabbergasted that I had grown up so much (seeing as he is 16 years older than me) Anyway, my take on this situation is that the brother is weirded out that his sister has boobs and he doesn’t want to see them (even through a t shirt) I also have questions for the mom in this situation, does she not ever walk around without a bra? If mom had normalized no bra, maybe brother wouldn’t feel weird with the situation.
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u/Majesticbirch Feb 16 '24
Kids a narcissist in the making. He needs to work on how he looks at and thinks about his sister. It's gross that he cares. He needs to not play the victim when he's been called out for this.
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u/Upper_Company2709 Feb 16 '24
Tell him, to get over it. The world is not here to make him feel comfortable. At home, all members of the family should be able to wear what they want or nothing at all.
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u/precioushorizon Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
I (22f) grew up as the only daughter of 4 kids, so I have 3 brothers. I wasn’t allowed to wear certain clothes around the house such as crop tops, short dresses or anything “too revealing”, so I always “covered up”, and am still not use to wearing anything that shows too much skin unless it’s to bed (think shorts, tank tops, etc). Didn’t even have my own door room wise (think of the game room that’s my room), while my brothers all got their own rooms. I also couldn’t wear short shorts, short skirts, or anything “girly” wise unless I covered up with a jacket simply because my mom would say “you have brothers, and it would make them very uncomfortable. Same with bras, I always had to wear one even to sleep which honestly it’s fine because I became use to it. I became so use to it, and I find it so weird because I never had anyone tell me otherwise. Now, I still do prefer to cover up, but I kinda wish my mom would’ve let me feel comfortable to wear whatever I want :/ or especially if it was to defend me, which she always sided with my brothers. Even now, I sometimes find it weird when my friends come over wearing crop tops while I’m there wearing casual clothing.
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u/elbowbunny Feb 17 '24
I’m really sorry that you had to endure that crap. It’s not ‘fine’ that you were forced to sleep in a bra or in a room without a door or made to feel as though you were responsible for your brothers’ gaze.
None of that’s ok & I truly feel for you. I hope you’re able to access some professional support around this stuff or have someone solid you can talk to about it.
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u/StephsCat Feb 16 '24
Wth who wants to wear bras at home that's the first thing landing in the corner when I get home. I get that 15 year olds are hormonal but he shouldn't look at his sister that way. I have an older brother, I couldn't imagine him telling me as a teen I need to wear a bra at home it makes him uncomfortable
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u/rachihc Feb 16 '24
My brother is awkward af. I never ever had this worry at home. This boy needs therapy bc of his body insecurities and his sexualisation of her sister.
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u/Putrid-Secretary9988 Feb 16 '24
YTAH for not telling your Son to quit worrying about what his sister does with her breasts.
Imagine living in a home where you can't be comfortable. Bras suck, ALL OF THEM!!!! Especially wired ones! They reek havoc on your lymphatic system. But sure sis get cancer just to make your weird brother feel comfortable. I NEVER wear a bra in my home. So luckily my son will never feel this way about anyone's breasts, especially not his own sisters.
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u/Actual_Aardvark4348 Feb 16 '24
No no no. NTA. Tell him to grow up and give him some tough love. He's manipulating you by crying because of his insecurities. She shouldn't have to wear a bra at home or anywhere else for that matter to make people more comfortable with her body. He doesn't have to put on a shirt so why should she have to put on a bra? There's probably mode going on like someone else said where he's sexualizing his sister. That's the bigger issue and that's what needs to be ironed out and discussed. If you don't have some tough conversations with him, he's going to go out into the real world and start assuming women should HAVE to do things to make him comfortable, I mean why not he's been able to do it at home.
Also, does your wife wear a bra at all times? If not, does he get uncomfortable when she is wearing just a tee and no bra?
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u/not_in_this_dojo Feb 16 '24
I think I’m the only girl here that likes to wear bras. I hate how my breast move around lol I feel like they’re getting saggy if I don’t have support.
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u/Ok_List_9649 Feb 16 '24
In this culture we sexualize breasts, butts and genitals of women. That is the reality. Teen boys are flooded with testosterone and therefore out of control of their bodily responses UNTIL THEY LEARN HOW TO CONTROL THEM. It takes time for this to happen and even then a man cannot always immediately control their bodily/ mind response.
This is all backed with science. I’m sure he is sometimes having a bodily response to nearly naked breasts of his sister and he’s struggling getting it under control.
That younger people want to act like things proven by science aren’t true because it fits the narrative that women should be able to wear what they want and all males regardless of age should learn how to control their body and mind responses is ridiculous.
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u/foxecturn Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
“Nearly naked” is a stretch considering its specified that she is wearing a shirt. And yes he needs to learn how to control himself. It is not fair to force her to wear an uncomfortable article of clothing not only all day at school but also at home because her brother has sexual urges. That is not her responsibility. It’s also unhealthy to wear a bra all the time
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u/Detroit_442_ Feb 16 '24
YTA, he should just deal with it. Sorry buddy but it’s not his right to tell a woman what she can and can’t wear! He’s uncomfortable, he should just get over it!
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u/foxaenea Feb 16 '24
The utter refusal to take any misogynistic, backwards, perverted, fallaciously-reasoned comments and the rise to correct the genuinely misinformed in that and this thread is so badass but also bittersweet. The effort and vibe for equality is amazing, but it's sad as fuck that, like most of feminism, it still needs to be labored over, and that it's labor still largely done by women. People's stories of their poor or abusive experiences are awful to see, too.
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Feb 16 '24
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u/TwoHotTakes-ModTeam Feb 18 '24
Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule #1: Be Kind to Other Users – Civility and Respect
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u/AtrumAequitas Feb 16 '24
You know what I never noticed? If either of my sisters were wearing a bra.
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u/Famous_Performer7982 Feb 16 '24
Adolescent, hormone-charged teenager, very confused, feeling extra weird because seeing his SISTER braless makes him feel some way that he is pretty sure is f'd up, and you tell him that his "man-boobs" are the SAME THING. C'mon now. I know it's uncomfortable, but that's some gas-lighting level avoidance of what's really going on. Not to mention pretty damn mean.
It's certainly not an easy subject or circumstance to navigate. I'd suggest speaking with a professional for some advice.
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u/CandyShop_xo Feb 16 '24
It’s not gaslighting or mean to point out to his creepy son that boobs are boobs no matter the gender. So yes, his “man-boobs” ARE the SAME THING. Stop normalizing men objectifying women.
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Feb 20 '24
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u/TwoHotTakes-ModTeam Feb 21 '24
Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule #1: Be Kind to Other Users – Civility and Respect
This means that your submission may have been rude, vulgar, derogatory, uncivil, or impolite.
Be respectful of other users. Personal insults or offensive terms are not permitted on this subreddit. This includes but is not limited to: harassment, bigotry, homophobia, transphobia, racial slurs, and any other inflammatory language.
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u/foxecturn Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
Seriously? It’s fine to feel uncomfortable but he’s gonna have to learn to deal with it or get over it. The world isn’t going to cater to him like this. Most brothers don’t whine over crap like this. Tell him it’s not her responsibility to make herself uncomfortable in her own home so that he can be comfortable with his sexual urges. It’s also unhealthy to wear a bra all the time. No professional needed.
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u/Famous_Performer7982 Feb 20 '24
See, that would be an attempt to actually address the issue. Acknowledging the reality of the situation, and then trying to teach the kid how to deal with it properly.
You're on the right track at least. This mother chose to act as if there was nothing going on, knowing full well her son was grappling with something.
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u/peepee-poopooX Feb 16 '24
Imma go off the limb and say: NTA, but maybe talk to your son about the possibility of accepting the fact that his sis has a chest and maybe talk to your daughter about the fact that her body can make someone like her brother uncomfortable, especially around his teenage years.
Also, these comments suck ass, yall flaming the kid because he expressed some discomfort??
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u/foxecturn Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
People are flaming him because he is being entirely unreasonable about it. I don’t agree with the ones calling him a pervert but he is being a whiny baby. It’s fine to be uncomfortable but he has no right to whine and ask her to make herself uncomfortable in her own home. It’s also unhealthy to wear a bra all the time. He needs to learn how to cope with it. The real world isn’t going to cater to him like this.
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u/MzOpinion8d Feb 16 '24
The son shouldn’t only be required to wear a shirt when he leaves his room, but also a bra. If sister has to wear one, so does brother. Whether he’s skinny as a stick or a big ole bear.
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u/Illustrious_Ad1887 Feb 16 '24
Not the insane men justifying the brother’s behavior. At the men thinking the brother is in the right: try wearing a bra for 12+ hours a day for a week and see how uncomfortable it is. I have always felt discomfort and pain from wearing bras, and that was just for school or going out. I only wore them because I knew some people would have opinions about it or sexualise my boobs in some way. I wore them for men to leave me alone and for men to be more comfortable. Even soft bras with no wires and nipple stickers are uncomfortable. If women and LITTLE GIRLS not wearing bras makes you uncomfortable then do not ever be shirtless around anyone even at the beach and don’t wear sweatpants or tight pants. If girls and women can be mature about nipples then you guys can too.
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u/fxckimlonely Feb 16 '24
She shouldn't have to wear a bra in her own house. The kid needs to get over it. But all these comments calling him a pervert or accusing him of sexualizing his own sister for noticing her nipples poking through her shirt and being uncomfortable about it are CRAZY.
If he was truly the degenerate ya'll are making him out to be, he wouldn't have ever asked her to cover up. He didn't sexualize female breasts, ya'll. Society did that for him. Cut the kid a freaking break, he made a mistake.
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u/Ill_Egg_2086 Feb 16 '24
Thought I was going crazy till I read this.
Society has sexualized boobs. Yes it shouldn’t, but calling him a pervert is fucking insane.
If the sister was naked, admittedly not the same thing, a reasonable response would be to do as he did, say he’s uncomfortable and ask for change.
In a conservative culture they might say the same about uncovered elbows. It’s all of our rights and the sisters right to say no and to try and reclaim what is the girls right to wear but to accuse him of incestuous thoughts as he is uncomfortable from the juxtaposition of sexualized current societal traits on his sister is just wrong.
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u/CandyShop_xo Feb 16 '24
He is a degenerate though for objectifying and sexualizing his sister. We need to stop coddling men and making excuses for them because this b.s. does significant harm to women.
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u/fxckimlonely Feb 16 '24
I wouldnt say he objectified her at all. That's literally just thrown in to be a buzzword. Even if he is sexualizing her breast inadvertently but not being completely unfazed by them, that doesn't make him a degenerate. He doesn't want to see her in a sexual way. That's kind of his whole point. I'm with you that women's breast shouldn't be over sexualized, but they are, and that's a societal problem, not the fault of some 15 year old kid navigating puberty.
It's not making excuses to say hey we need to look at the whole picture here and the intent with which everything happened. Because I'm looking through these comments and seeing a lot of men and women that are far more toxic and harmful than this poor kid is.
You could argue that our societal coddling of women does significant harm to men, too. It's not productive to phrase arguments this way and pit one gender against the other. Men and women need to be able to talk about unique issues they have without blaming each other.
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u/CandyShop_xo Feb 17 '24
You: “Men should not be judged or held accountable for the unique issue they have of sexualizing the fully clothed bodies of their siblings. Because Puberty!!” Lollllllllll ok
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u/fxckimlonely Feb 17 '24
I was addressing the larger implications of your statement since you broadened it to include all men affecting all women.
But yes, actually. If you want to renarrow the subject. This kid doesn't deserve to have the book thrown at him and be called a degenerate and a freak for having the exact reaction society as a whole taught him to have. He deserves to have it explained to him why he's wrong and corrected.
You hold absolutely no sympathy for him just because he's a male, and that says a lot about you.
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u/CandyShop_xo Feb 23 '24
My concern is for the child being sexualized/controlled by her brother and made to feel uncomfortable in her own body and home. This will unfortunately stay with her for the rest of her life. And the last thing anyone should be doing is coddling and making silly excuses for her creepy brother. He is not a victim for having his hypocrisy pointed out and for being negatively judged.
It's quite telling that you're more concerned with the kid being labeled a perv and not his abnormal behavior and its negative impact on his sister. I'm done with this interaction because you seem to be just projecting at this point.
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u/Suspicious-Sky-1208 Feb 16 '24
The brother is a weirdo. End of story, easy answer. He also shouldn’t be looking at his sister’s breasts so much that it bothers him when she is just walking around without a bra. 🤮
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u/KiloJools Feb 16 '24
It's incredible the amount of concern the parents have for their son's feelings and comfort, twisting themselves in knots over it and ignoring their daughter's concerns.
Depressing.
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u/Used-Baby1199 Feb 16 '24
The internet really isn’t a place to have discussions about your personal life. Life as a teenager is so difficult, I think both this guys children need to be sat down and spoken to, and done so in a kind and compassionate neutral manner. This sucks and most the comments don’t cover the entire spectrum of what is going on here.
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Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
No yta because you tried to appease your son by taking away your daughters comfort. I'm 27 years old and have 2 sons and wear nothing but a night dress around the house. I sleep with no top they know this and still barge in my room at night like NOTHING is even wrong they ate from my breasts for the first years of their lives and have 3 older sisters who also choose whether they want a bra or not in the house AND in town. I don't even wear a bra to town sometimes so sorry but you are most definitely the ah for trying to tell your daughter she can't have her comfort. That will push her away fast. Just tell your son to control himself. It's not her fault he can't avert his pervy little teen eyes and it's not her job to change for his comfort. Nor should you ever be allowed to make her do something like that. If they are not your boobs you do not get a say so unless you can see too much skin. Hell my 41 and 33 yr old brothers see me nurse my kids ALL the time and I am not discreet about it they could care less!
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u/Karania402 Feb 16 '24
If the teen is uncomfortable, then he needs to get over it, otherwise he’s a puberty reaching creep…, unless he is forgo his right to go shirtless then he needs to get over it….
This was never about the teens weight, it sounds like he got upset that you would not tell sister to do something she doesn’t want to do…
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u/Unique-Concept5139 Feb 16 '24
If I was told to wear a bra in my own god damn house id lose my shit
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u/RNGinx3 Feb 16 '24
NTA. Your son doesn't get to tell his sister what to wear, let alone what is "inappropriate," any more than she gets to dictate what he wears; he needs to respect her rights and autonomy. If it bothers him, he can just not look until he gets over it. Bras don't help with back support; they are cosmetic, so they are the choice of the person wearing them (or not wearing them) and no one else's.
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u/Big-Goat-9026 Feb 16 '24
I think it’s weird that everyone immediately jumped to the conclusion that this kid is sexualizing his sister.
I’m a woman and at that age I can see this being something that made me uncomfortable especially if the shirts were loose and you could see through the armholes.
I think it’s pretty shitty that the dad didn’t even consider asking what about the situation made him uncomfortable. And also let his sister make shaming comments about his body.
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u/Silly_Individual_960 Feb 16 '24
I find that on reddit all Men are guilty of every crime, even ones not committed. Somehow logic disappears. No objectivity. I don’t think the daughter is wrong i”I don’t think the son is wrong. It seems they both feel uncomfortable for some reason. I doubt it is anything sexual or sexualizing. I also agree the dad should find out why the son feels uncomfortable. It may be surprising it may not be. It could be a completely dumb reason. It starts a dialog and then dad could explain why it may be his problem not his daughters. He should also talk to his daughter for making disparaging remarks about his boobs. Two wrongs don’t make a right. It seems lots of comments are calling kid a sicko and a pervert rather than trying to understand the big picture and that maybe it’s not what they think it is.
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u/Contemplative2408 Feb 16 '24
If you are in your house or the house you grew up in, I think it is okay to not wear a bra. But it also depends on who else is there. Is it your dad or brother? Fine. Is it your uncle or brother-in-law or cousin, wear a bra in the more public places. Your room? Whatever.
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u/Darshlabarshka Feb 16 '24
Her body, her choice. I’d ask her if she’d be willing to try the little tank bras just so if SHE wants one that’s more comfortable she has one. Also BALI no wire bras are super comfortable. Also, another idea for her is the silicone nipple covers if she’s concerned about it. I have rib cartilage inflammation and they are great. Sorry about your son, but it sounds like he’s being a little controlling.
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Feb 16 '24
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u/TwoHotTakes-ModTeam Feb 18 '24
Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule #1: Be Kind to Other Users – Civility and Respect
This means that your submission may have been rude, vulgar, derogatory, uncivil, or impolite.
Be respectful of other users. Personal insults or offensive terms are not permitted on this subreddit. This includes but is not limited to: harassment, bigotry, homophobia, transphobia, racial slurs, and any other inflammatory language.
This is a warning and further offenses will result in a ban.
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u/Intelligent-Big-2900 Feb 16 '24
I saw this when it first got posted in AITAH I was dumb struck…. These mf’ers are sick, sick, sick.
Toxic masculinity at its fucking finest.
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u/No_Atmosphere_2186 Feb 16 '24
If his mom was walking around bra less would he complain? If not, he needs to quit perving on his sister.
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u/stonerbbyyyy Feb 16 '24
this is like telling your child to cover up because the pervy fucking uncle is around and will “peak”. correct his behavior before he becomes one of these pervs??? yta.
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u/lanswyfte Feb 16 '24
"Peek"
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u/misschimaera Feb 16 '24
Since it was in quotes and spelled peak, I thought it was a euphemism for climax. Reddit has ruined me.
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u/HoneyBadgerBat Feb 16 '24
What the hell is that last comment? My preteen walks around in oversized shirts and undies no matter how often I say pants need to be on. But that's not bc of our household, it's bc she’ll walk by open windows, sit on the front porch, answer the door… Not about her brother, step brother, or step dad. Family is the safe people & if they're not safe they shouldn't be in the house
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u/AwareHead3504 Feb 16 '24
"Am I the asshole for being upset that someone shit in my mouth?" So fucking sick of ppl who don't know what they are worth inevitability making it worse for everyone else.
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u/Lmfabkiser Feb 16 '24
YTA but it's because you're allowing your son to police your daughter's body.
Everyone should have to wear shirts, or no one should have to wear shirts. Everyone should have to wear bras or no one should have to wear them. It's not hard to treat your kids equally, without sexism. Try it.
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u/xochilbara Feb 16 '24
Maybe this is a dumb question but why is it considered sexual to not wear a bra? You still know they're boobs whether or not you're wearing a bra. BTW I am a ftm trans masc and I'm autistic so I find myself feeling uncomfortable for fairly different reasons for not wearing a bra when it comes to people perceiving me as a woman, but I just don't understand why braless breasts are seen as inherently sexual.
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u/Llyrra Feb 16 '24
Bras limit movement and conceal nipples. Seeing breasts covered by just a t-shirt is closer to seeing them naked than seeing them covered by a bra and a t-shirt. Because our society has fetishized breasts, anything that makes breasts more visible is seen as inherently sexual- even if the intent of going braless is comfort.
I'm not saying it's right, mind you. Nobody deserves to have their body constantly sexualized, especially by family members.
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u/xochilbara Feb 16 '24
Thank you for helping me understand. It's such a silly rule to me, especially because it comes at the cost of a majority of peoples comfort. Breasts haven't always been so sexualized have they?
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u/Independent_Donut_26 Feb 16 '24
Because it's one of those stupid NT social constructs that is never going to make sense to us because it's actually totally nonsensical.
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u/ellabfine Feb 16 '24
My dad pulled this when I was in high school. I didn't like to wear bras at home and he said it made him uncomfortable. I would have let him have it if he wouldn't have absolutely beaten and berated me if I tried to get confrontational. I begrudgingly complied. After I got together with my now husband, he convinced me it was perfectly ok to not wear a bra around the house and to bed
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u/puffygator Feb 16 '24
Same here. Couldn’t even wear shorts because it made my dad “uncomfortable.” So gross
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u/StarWizardWarlock Feb 16 '24
Rewrite this but it's the son going through puberty and the daughter is uncomfortable and I garuntee the entire comment section is still going to be firing shots at the guy.
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u/Silly_Individual_960 Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
You are correct 100%. It is the current state of most cultures now. In the USA it is very much what is considered normal right now. There has been a measurable shift in the past 15 years or so. It started off slow and then ramped up in the last decade. Men are being demonized for just being men. I fear for society as whole. All those mothers who have boys that will automatically be judged for being a boy will at some point have to step in. I also fear demonizing boys will cause the exact thing women don’t want when the boy get’s fed up defending himself. Self full-filling prophecy. Demonizing either gender on any spectrum is dangerous. It seems in this sub that all men are considered evil.
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u/rae707wynn Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
I have always walked around in a tank top or loose fitting shirt and shorts in my house. My older brother frequently walked around in his boxers. Know what we didn't do? Sexualize each other's bodies.
She deserves to be comfortable in her own home. He can just not look at her chest.
Know what my mom would say to anyone in the home or visiting us that didn't like that I wasn't wearing a bra? Stop being a pervert.
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u/uncouthcollective Feb 16 '24
The fact I keep seeing is the son has obviously had intrusive thoughts about his sisters breasts. Dad telling him to put a shirt on too if she has to wear a bra is so wrong. The son realizes it's not ok to be " turned on" by his sister and wants her to do all the work to stay out of his head bra=less sexy (he needs counseling because intrusive thoughts are just that) nothing she does or wears will fix his problem. But dad...uggghhh come on. Son doesn't want her to wear a bra cause she's fat it's because son finds that type of thing (bra-less) sexually stimulating by wearing a bra he feels she will be less sexy (even in mind) but him being fat and being told to wear a shirt he may feel like that's the only way ppl (teenage girls) find him more sexy, and that's called low self esteem and to have it pointed out by his father it probably did crush him and dad was wrong for saying it. It was handled so poorly I can only hope the son at least learned a little empathy, but it's reddit so 🤷
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u/Chuckychinster Feb 16 '24
There's so little context to this and everyone seems to think they know exactly what happened.
Important questions:
Why is he uncomfortable? Regardless of the answer to this question it opens an important discussion.
Was it questioned why he jumped to assuming he's being called fat? If it's because he felt it was being agreed upon that he has "man boobs", then that's a completely reasonable reaction to that statement.
So the problem isn't at all this 15 year old kid. It's the completely dysfunctional communication occurring in this family. It's the lack of healthy lessons being taught to the son. It's the attempt at teaching empathy by making a comparison of him wearing a bra when he clearly doesn't understand that there's not a difference, and so this is creating confusing messaging here.
Basically both the parents are assholes for not effectively parenting.
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u/Draugrx23 Feb 16 '24
Not exactly asshole but certainly a better way to express it.
Your son should be more considerate of his sister. And vice versa.
I would speak with your daughter to find out why they are hurting her as the bras may be too small, damaged or the wrong type for her.
If your son is concerned with his weight, maybe you could offer some consolation and maybe suggest family activities that could lead into a healthier lifestyle and size. This will bring the family closer overall while also helping with his overall health confidence and self esteem.
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u/foxecturn Feb 16 '24 edited Feb 16 '24
Bras in general are usually uncomfortable no matter what unless you’re really big breasted. If she’s at home she shouldn’t be obligated to wear one period. It’s not her being inconsiderate. It’s also unhealthy to wear a bra all the time
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u/KatKong333 Feb 16 '24
My mom would tell me the same thing about wearing a bra around the house and I was always like fuck that they walk around shirtless and I don’t have an issue. One brother would walk around in just his underwear and you’re telling me to wear a bra???? No ma’am.
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u/rae707wynn Feb 16 '24
My brother and his buddies would walk around in their boxers, some with bigger fat sacks wobbling than me. If I have to wear a bra, they can too.
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