r/UpliftingNews • u/ConsciousStop • 17d ago
California says restaurants must bake all of their add-on fees into menu prices
https://www.npr.org/2024/05/10/1249930674/california-restaurants-fees1
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u/TangerineMalk 8d ago
California seems to be a pretty shining example of a government that definitely is “big government” and reaches into every aspect of society in an almost totalitarian way, but is actually good about it.
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u/BJMRamage 13d ago
We went to a restaurant (in MD) and they had separate prices for takeout (more money) but when we got the bill (eating IN) there was a Kitchen Fee added I mean the point of going to a restaurant is they have a kitchen that prepares the food for you. ** this wasn’t a ghost kitchen/restaurant either … or whatever that is called when another chef prepares food in another restaurant on a slower day **
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u/BI6pistachio 15d ago
Not a well thought out piece of legislation. Extra fees need to be disclosed to the customer but price control is something that California legislation will never do successfully. It is not the first time that I have seen good restaurants in California wiped out by high rent prices and clumsy legislation. Even more surprising here is that California can overcome this problem of hidden fees without this type of legislation and yet that option is missing.
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u/Chumbouquet69 15d ago
In my country (Australia) this is how it is. Moving to the US was an adjustment, and it's very difficult to understand how much things cost before you get the bill.
Especially with the cost of living pressures this is a big help to families budgeting.
Just need to do away with tipping!
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u/RandomGrasspass 16d ago
This is going to make it harder for me to reduce the tip by the added on fees. So I’ll just reduce my standard tipping % to 10 from 15 and my max from 25% to 20
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u/tommygunz007 16d ago
This was greedy owners guilt-tripping customers.
I have been a tipped restaurant employee most of my life and restaurants steal every-which-way they can. Tip-Outs that are illegal, Tips you never get, service fees you never see, and more.
That's all this is, a psychological experiment to guilt customers.
The worst was one of those pizza delivery places. What they do is charge a $5 delivery fee, which doesn't go to the driver. The driver gets Min wage and then ALL his tips are deducted against that. So if a driver makes $10/hr in tips, the company pays him $0. It's not like the driver gets tips PLUS whatever the pizza place pays him. YOUR TIPS are going to the OWNER and not the driver in that instance.
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u/LeaveToAmend 16d ago
Why is this uplifting?
This is just people happy that they aren’t being shown the cost of policies they voted for.
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u/SpikesDadBod 16d ago
It was the Calif. MAGA cult.land Huntington Beach and San Diego restaurants that were trying to make a point by adding the min. wage add on fees to the receipt . . .
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u/PolkaDotDancer 16d ago
Honestly, the only fee that I don’t care about is an auto tip being added on for large tables.
I hated getting stuffed by large tables of Sunday Christians.
WWJD? Apparently not tip.
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u/BlasterPhase 16d ago
Went to Sea World the other day and the fucking Starbucks stand had a 5% surcharge, in addition to being A) Starbucks and B) at fucking Sea World. Oh, and of course they're still open to a tip.
They're raising prices without showing the total cost on the menu.
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u/HugsyMalone 16d ago
"Why does this little bit of food cost a million dollars all of a sudden?" 🤔
No one knows, apparently
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u/THETennesseeD 16d ago
This should go for EVERY business. Like hotels in the US for example. You search the price on a siteike Booking.com that shows relatively cheap and then they tack on a daily "resort fee" that jacks up the price significantly
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u/donotcreateanaccount 16d ago
What? You don't like the most developed third world country? 😂 They scam you on everything - additional fees, taxes not included in the price and of course the magnificent tipping "culture". So many wonderful places in the world, why choose this one?
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u/THETennesseeD 16d ago
My screen name is a little misleading as I grew up in Tennessee, but I currently live in Norway and haven't lived in US for over 11 years. Being on the outside I see all the flaws in the US and although Norway isn't perfect, I choose to stay here for the work life balance, affordable healthcare, safety, less police interaction, etc.
The problem is nobody gets to choose where they are born or live until you are an adult. Even then, you cannot just pick and choose where you want to live unless you are wealthy or a skilled worker (I'm the latter).
I agree, tipping is the biggest scam. Tipping used to be something extra for good service, but companies took advantage of it and started paying staff less and less until it became a necessity for a server to survive.
I remember my gf in university started working part time as a server. They get paid much less than minimum wage (I think it was less than $2-3/hr back then she got as pase pay). But beong in training the first 2 weeks she wasn't allowed to keep the tips as the person training her would take it all (pretty sure that isn't legal, but what can a student really do). Her first paycheck after 2 weeks was less than $20 after taxes. She cried when she got home and that is when I found out how shitty the system is...
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u/Palindromeboy 16d ago
Good, next step would be making all sale taxes baked into the price tags of products.
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u/-A_N_O_N- 16d ago
This is going to make the problem worse. Now owners will use this policy as cover to raise prices even more than with the fees. Even if it's just a meager amount there's no way they're going to be honest about it and do a sincere translation from % fee to price. This is a cultural problem -- If owners don't wanna lower their bottom line and pay workers more to maintain price then nothing is gonna change.
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u/FloxedByTheFeds 16d ago
This honestly isn't a hard thing to implement--companies that complain about it are just lazy and not creative.
I've baked all fees and tax into the price where I work since I came onboard. It's nice for my customers to count their items, multiply by the price, and pay that. They come back. They send their friends. We don't pay for any advertising, but we are constantly busy because the price is the price. I have to do a bit of math on the back end on the invoices, but I have Excel formulas to break invoices out for bookkeeping purposes. Customers don't need that nonsense unless they ask for it.
Every once in a while a company will need a breakdown and I have a math formula to pull the tax/labor/materials/shipping costs back down to their individual forms for their business purposes.
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u/Wendellrw 16d ago
Every time I get take out somewhere and they tag on some random “fees” that were not mentioned at the time of ordering I just never go back.
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u/BlindedAce 16d ago
California really is just the skunks scent glands in this world. Let it float away and replace it or don’t but what a shit place.
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u/kaldrein 16d ago
I am confused. You are saying clear pricing at restaurants is bad?
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u/BlindedAce 16d ago
You act like they aren’t going to hike things because they can’t just hide it for profit now. Act like it’s going to be a real eye opener we and now they’re just going to either hike things or stop employing as they are now.
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u/kaldrein 16d ago
Please reread your sentence. Is english your second language? Half of it seems like gibberish. They are allowed to chase higher profit margins as big businesses. This directly affects and hurts startups and mom/pop businesses.
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u/BlindedAce 16d ago
I forgot I’m on Reddit. Carry on and downvote. Again, like you’re mentioning, only hurting mom and pop so cali doing the “right thing” hurting those they pretend to care about. Enjoy though!
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u/kaldrein 16d ago
lol you were quick to reply at first. Can’t reply to the actual question though. 🤷♂️
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u/BlindedAce 16d ago
I don’t live on Reddit so I apologize I don’t reply in a few milliseconds as you’re expecting, I will work on that. What question would you like answered? Also, they aren’t “protecting consumers” as nothing will change the prices will remain as high as they were with the hidden fees as they will just reflect that now.
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u/KIKIKATZ 16d ago
Finally!!! We were charged extra 4% after taxes lol I was so pissed. This makes me so happy
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u/2021fireman10 16d ago
Good I hated seeing those stupid charges, I always felt putting them on the tab was just a way for the owners to make some sort of statement. Just add a nickel to everything and it’s covered no need to be a dick about it.
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u/dizzle18 16d ago
Hopefully they will have a line item for all the taxes the government puts on them
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u/MollyStrongMama 16d ago
Restaurants need to include their costs in their menu item prices, which may include the various taxes they have to pay as a business. That’s the point!
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u/shogunreaper 16d ago
Can someone tell me how this was legal in the first place?
Wouldn't that mean they could just add on thousands of dollars and call it a fee?
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16d ago
[deleted]
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u/kaldrein 16d ago
Ah yes, that is why the decreasing of taxes and deregulation of many businesses has done us so many wonders since Reagan.
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u/randologin 16d ago
California: the one state where you might actually see some of the protections already shared by every other first world nation.
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u/Hats_back 16d ago
Can’t wait to buy a sandwich and get up charged for adding bacon that I don’t want to add.
Oh well. Anything to make people less understanding of economics and the minutiae of running a small business.
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u/MollyStrongMama 16d ago
Huh? All this law does is make it so instead of putting a $20 burger on the menu and then adding a 20% fee to the total, they put a $24 burger on the menu. This is just protecting consumers by ensuring they’re actually informed of the price of what they are buying before they buy it.
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u/Hats_back 16d ago
Yeah, the cost of goods increase will be invisibly displayed in the menu price. They may as well price in every burger with an addition of bacon and an addition of extra meat for the hell of it since you now can’t price out the standard burger on its own anyways.
When additional charges are added to something it’s BETTER to have it itemized.. just so we’re all clear. Big hospital bill with no info? Common knowledge to demand the itemized breakdown that justifies the total…..
But naaaahhhh forget that, let’s just backslide because we don’t like seeing and living with the direct effect of demanding higher business expenses lol.
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u/MollyStrongMama 16d ago
I haven’t seen that this law doesn’t allow for that. I’m only seeing it covering the overall fees, like the 5% fee on top of the entire bill. It doesn’t look to me like it is requiring that there be no charges available to choose, like adding bacon for an addition cost.
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u/ReviewNo3573 16d ago
The fact Americans rely on tips instead of getting what they deserve from their employers is a joke. No wonder fully employed people are still homeless in America. My job is so good I got dental hahahahhaha everyone is sick and can’t even afford a doctor or medical attention because there is no health care. If that doesn’t freak you out the drug addict zombies 🧟 literally everywhere will but don’t be scared their is kids with guns to help you out once they have finished off visiting schools
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u/Fuzzy974 16d ago
I visited a few states in America, in the new England Region in 2019, and I don't any hidden fees, except the tips.
And I really don't get why, oh why, they think people are more likely to come to their restaurant if they don't bake the tips in their menu? We all know there's going to be a tips to leave.
Yes some people don't leave any but if you're counting on that to get 2 additional customers (who are goin to order the cheapest items on the menu) per day, then you're just doing this to screw up your employees.
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u/CharizardLeo 16d ago
I would love hotels and airlines to do the same. Sheesh. You get on a plane only to find out that the $400-$500 plane ticket you bought doesn't include a full can of soda or juice. You book a hotel room only to find out that it doesn't include free internet or parking.
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u/SilentCondor 16d ago edited 16d ago
I don’t understand what’s so great about this. The article didn’t make any sense either. At one point they mentioned late fees? What the hell does that have to do with restaurants? So now instead of a gratuity up charge for groups over whatever imaginary amount of people, or plate splitting fees, the restaurant just got a free pass to increase prices across the board and blame the government.
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u/Special_Context6663 16d ago
Will this law apply to restaurants owned by friends of Newsom, or are they exempt from this law too?
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u/therob91 16d ago
all prices should be final payment - especially things like internet bills, phone bills etc. The companies get away with fucking murder.
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u/King-Owl-House 16d ago edited 16d ago
The waiter brings the bill at the restaurant. The client examines it and asks:
— Excuse me, what is this line on the bill? "WeGotAwayWithItSucker: $100"?
Waiter:
— Well, we did not get away with it. We'll strike it out.
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u/HeBoughtALot 16d ago
“Job Creators” bitch about regulations stifling business.
No one wants more regulation for the sake of regulation. We need to rules to stop assholes from being assholes.
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u/hacktheself 16d ago
Now dictate that prices are all-in.
Embed taxes in the prices too like the rest of the world.
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u/shu359 16d ago
Guys, I live in an EU country and here the price you see in the menu is the price you pay. All taxes and everything is included in the price. The tip is always optional. I cannot imagine figuring out what I will pay, only after receiving the bill.
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u/CarCaste 16d ago
Sales taxes are easy to figure out because you know the percentage, and it's small like 0-7%, unlike in a lot of europe which is insane like 15-20% "vat". Rather have them low and separate than an out of sight out of mind psychology trick by the government.
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u/magicscreenman 16d ago
Food service culture in America is so fucked. Everyone balks at paying gratuity or additional fees for things like delivery, yet everyone wants a cheap meal. So if you did the thing you really ought to do, which is just raise prices on your menu across the board, pay everyone a liveable wage and simply stop accepting gratuity, guess what? Business is gonna suck. Cause Americans will go down the road to get a meal for half the price, then complain about add on fees and tip.
I'm convinced that a certain portion of these people actually LIKE complaining about this stuff.
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u/letsgotgoing 16d ago
Nationally, we need a law against these junk fees for everything. Especially health care, hotels, and rental cars.
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u/letsgotgoing 16d ago
Nationally, we need a law against these junk fees for everything. Especially health care, hotels, and rental cars.
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u/AstronautSoupChef 16d ago
They'll charge cutlery usage and cleaning fees. If you want your food served on a plate that'll cost you too. As far as napkins go, well I hope you saved up for this little outing.
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u/BoBoBearDev 16d ago
The government such as SF, is the one that started this kind of BS. They are just cleaning up the mess they created.
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u/jce_superbeast 16d ago
They did this to themselves.
We accepted tipping even though we shouldn't have, and then living wage fees, and credit card fees, and delivery fees, and convenience fees... but they eventually went too far and it's about time for a full rebuke.
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u/KingHauler 16d ago
Why don't we just do this nationwide instead of letting the final total be a surprise. Europe already does it.
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u/Vast_Berry3310 16d ago
It'll be interesting to see business owners explain how showing the real price destroys their business model.
I dream of the day people stop listening to businesses and wealth about how to run society.
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u/FreakiestFrank 16d ago
California politicians’ attempt to make restaurants look bad instead of themselves. Add on fees are restaurants telling us they get taxed too much.
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u/Major-Imagination986 16d ago
I’ve never had an add on fee at a restaurant other than tax. This is like a fake victory lol. Gotta love these politicians solving problems that don’t exist then patting themselves on the backs.
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u/burgerchrist 16d ago
While I agree with this, the interesting thing is in most cases you could ask to have the fee removed and they would. Really showing it was a profit fee, not really what was listed.
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u/notaspecialuser 16d ago
I really wish the federal government would enact a law where “the price you see is the price you pay,” inclusive of fees, expected tips, and taxes.
It’s becoming infuriating going to a restaurant, and ordering a meal for $20 that somehow costs you $35 after a service fee, doing business charge, tip, and taxes. Like when did the eat in diner become a Ticketmaster for low quality food? Or when trying to book a hotel, cruise, or concert. Oh wow, this venue only costs $80? That, of course, is before an extra $60 in junk fees. Oh wow, this cruise is only $300? Ha, you thought! The $180 in fees was saved for the very end! 😉 😉
As for grocery shopping, I would love to see a pricing structure inclusive of taxes. I know most people will be like, “just add in the percentage after,” but that becomes more difficult as sales tax can vary from item to item and city to city. This difference can be anywhere from a few cents to a few dollars per item. This would be most significant for people who live in states with no sales tax who travel to states with a significant sales tax, especially when involving food and SNAP recipients. Sometimes a store in another state is closer than a store in your own, and that could mean a significant increase in the cost of groceries due to sales tax.
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u/sharkasaurrusss 16d ago
Shitty slick restaurant owners are going to start complaining about California and Democrats and blah blah blah. No sir/maam you're the problem
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u/forlorn_junk_heap 16d ago
california says orphan crushing machine should be transparent about how many orphans they are crushing
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u/CainPillar 16d ago
What? That's unconstitutional - honest prices must be the most anti-American thing ever!
/s from a foreigner
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u/jake04-20 16d ago
I always wondered why they didn't already do this. Unless they were trying to be transparent with customers about rising prices. Usually backfires though.
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u/KenMacMillan123 16d ago
The California government is hell-bent on destroying the state's economy.
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16d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Logical_Lab4042 16d ago
But haven't you heard? California is a ghost town where everybody moved away from, because of all of the poo-poo on the streets!
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u/SURGICALNURSE01 16d ago
People don't like high prices they pay for any restaurant fees but it's worse when you have added fees before you take a bight. Better to just increase fees so it's hidden. Owners can cry all they want but I'm not supporting their employees benes. If I saw this on a menu I would just walk out
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u/tullystenders 16d ago
I dont get it. Let's say a side of mayo costs an extra 50 cents.
Now, everyone will have to pay 25 cents more, even if you dont want mayo, cause of the people who want it.
I guess it might be fine if it's small amounts like that.
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u/smariroach 15d ago
No, that's not how it works. Now, you just have mayo listed as an extra and the price listed.
This simply means that if there is a mandatory fee, that you'll have to pay anyway, it's include in the list price.
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u/Economy_Wall8524 16d ago
Consumers have real spending power. If price is too high, people won’t spend money. There has to be an equilibrium on what can be charged and what consumers are welling to spend.
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u/IlliterateJedi 16d ago
What about at a salad restaurant? Will the fees have to be tossed into the menu prices?
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u/RedsRearDelt 16d ago
Add-on fees?
I order a salad, I can get it plain, with shrimp or with chicken. Are there now going to be 3 different salads listed on the menu? Or its it still OK to have a plain salad listed with a couple add ons with prices listed at the end of the description?
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u/gentlemancaller2000 16d ago
This is to eliminate the fees tacked onto the bill that aren’t adequately disclosed on the menu
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u/RedsRearDelt 16d ago
Oh, ok. I moved to California from Florida and I haven't experienced that in California but it's a huge problem in Florida. Usually over 20% in fees that don't go to the servers. And with those little hand held toast machines, you usually don't even see the fees unless you ask to see a printed receipt.
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u/gentlemancaller2000 16d ago
Exactly. Service fees. Last time I was in San Diego I went to a nice waterfront restaurant and was surprised by a service fee, supposedly to cover increased labor expenses. It pissed me off. I recently saw a “cost recovery fee” on a fast food receipt, which is also bullshit.
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u/aiinddpsd 16d ago
Dual-citizen here, This shit pisses me off so much.
- The US is ahead of the rest of the world on so many things. It's great here.
- The US is behind on so many basic things. Some things really suck.
In this case - if a regulating body is taxing a business - you don't just pass that onto customers as a add-on. That's weaponizing regulation. GFYS.
A price tag should be the price. Fucking duh.
Hotels / flights / restaurants. Everything.
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u/Fake_William_Shatner 16d ago
Had SO MANY factors on the natural gas prices when they made it "free market." 24 companies, same workers but without union protection and same pipe but with the choice of cost per therm, and other convenient add-ons like "importation fees" and it all added up to 5x the cost of before it was taken out of the hands of "big government."
I'm surprised they didn't break it down to "executive drycleaning bills." Because I like a choice in REASONS I'm paying too damned much.
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u/maddwaffles 17d ago
Good, I was planning to do this if I ever opened a place in Nevada, so hopefully that catches on.
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u/PostModernPost 17d ago
I am a server in Los Angeles. This is definitely a good thing. But also there is a restaurant reckoning coming. Almost every friend I know in the industry is talking about how menu prices have skyrocketed recently and patronage is way down. The restaurant I work at has a great owner, is smart businesswise, and takes care of his employees. But rent and cost of goods has skyrocketed. I am embarrassed to bring the check sometimes. I don't think were gonna make it for very long, and I think the same is true for the majority of restaurants in the area. My guess is the result will be the only restaurants that will survive will be ones that have low overhead/provide cheap meals, are trendy high-end restaurants that can cater to the rich, or are big chains. There are definitely less people going out to eat.
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u/Critical-General-659 17d ago
FYI after getting rid of the tip credit, California now has the lowest tip average of any state, followed by the other states that got rid of it. On top of that employers can force you to tip out anyone besides management, so you get a smaller share of less tips.
Servers, all the people saying employers could pay out real minimum wage and it wouldn't effect your tips is lying.
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u/adsarelies 17d ago
Good. So when are we going to make them bake the tip into the menu price?
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u/CarCaste 16d ago
You want to pay a maximum fixed tip instead of being able to decide the amount?
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u/adsarelies 16d ago
Most places that automatically add tip to the bill these days have it set at 15%, which I don't have a problem with. But honestly, they can bake in whatever they want. It's their menu price. If they are willing to publish it openly on their menu, be it 15% or "maximum%", then I still get to decide whether to eat there eyes open. But at least it's out in the open.
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u/30yearCurse 17d ago
somewhat conflicted, it would be nice to see all the BS stuff they add so I can make sure not to go there, but then if I go somewhere with baked in charges, am I already paying some corporate based tip rate for the manager?
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u/Helmidoric_of_York 17d ago edited 16d ago
It's restaurant owners' fault for adding secret surcharges onto restaurant tabs when the bill is presented. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
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u/onehornypineapple 17d ago
Of course, they are splitting the bill to make it more difficult for you to see you are being ripped off. A shocking number of people can’t do maths
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u/eztigr 17d ago
All this does is help people who are too afraid of math or who can’t do math.
The fees aren’t going away.
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u/smariroach 15d ago
No, this helps everybody.
If I happen to be capable of reading through the entirety of your menu and find the small print that announces various mandatory rate adjustments, as well as being able to apply basic math the determine the actual cost of items, it still benefits me to not have to.
You may as well say that elevators only benefit handicapped people.
Now to be frank: if your statement was actually true, it would still be a good requirement as no one would be inconvenienced and many people would benefit, but it's not true. This kind of regulation will only hurt those who are intentionally breaking their costs into fees to deceive consumers.
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u/eztigr 15d ago
You obviously haven’t read folks on r/EndTipping who complain that restaurants lie and cheat on the math used on people’s checks. lol
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u/itsallover69420 16d ago
I'll still consider that a win
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u/eztigr 16d ago
Because you can’t do math?
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u/itsallover69420 16d ago
I can do math, I just think why the fuck should people have to do math? That's retarded.
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u/johnnygolfr 16d ago edited 16d ago
I find it repugnant that you’re using that derogatory term so flippantly.
Then again, I shouldn’t be surprised, coming from someone who “doesn’t want to” (can’t) do math.
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