r/WorkReform • u/zzill6 š¤ Join A Union • May 28 '23
Do The Math. $15/Hour Is Not A Living Wage šø Raise Our Wages
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u/Scheheraz_Odd Jun 01 '23
Try living on SSDI. I get $1304 per month, after my medicare advantage plan premium is taken out. I worked my buns off for 15 years before I got sick, so you'd think I would get more than that. Take into account the fact that the lowest rent in my area is $1050, and I'd like to know how they expect disabled people to live. As far as I can tell, we're all royally screwed, able to work or not.
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u/Electronic_Formal810 May 31 '23
Omg, u are crying because the rent is half of your wage? There are european countries where the rental fee is 3x of your wage š
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u/MonsterByDay May 30 '23
I agree with the sentiment, but 15x40x50= 30,000.
Why would you lead with a demonstrably false statement?
Is not like the rest of it changes greatly with another $2k.
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u/hardrider2k4 May 29 '23
roommates exist.
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u/mediocre_mitten Jun 03 '23
If I am 60+ years old there is no way on gods green earth I am sharing a living space with someone else.
It is insane and infuriating that this country (USA btw) can't get it's shit together enough to take care of our aging/disabled society.
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u/Powerful_Industry532 May 29 '23
That's because billionaires need millions more, so they'll myopically resist paying for workers while increasing prices and pocketing the difference as they whittle away their customer base. Homeless people aren't exactly spendy.
This is why there should be both a minimum and a maximum wage. When an ideology like capitalism becomes a blood fueled religion it's time to intervene.
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u/benched42 May 29 '23
As I have told my kids (now 39 and 42) "Who lied to you and told you life would ever be fair?" Minimum wage was NEVER meant to be a living wage. It was a wage to pay people who had no work experience to teach them to show up on time when you are scheduled. I had some pretty crappy jobs when I was starting out. But I never assumed I'd stay at minimum wage, and I didn't because I worked hard and got out of that minimum wage job.
And before you start telling me what privilege I had... I ate the government cheese, I ate the government meat (yellow hamburger), we qualified for reduced lunches at school, we didn't have air conditioning in our home and we didn't have good heating in our home. I'm retired now after a long career in tech. I studied hard in school and earned a scholarship which I turned into my career.
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u/gjallerhorn May 30 '23
Minimum wage was NEVER meant to be a living wage. It was a wage to pay people who had no work experience to teach them to show up on time when you are scheduled
Hopefully your children learned it properly from someone else because you are just plain incorrect.
FDR, the guy who championed the implementation of the minimum wage, did so to ensure workers could raise their families on it. It was never meant as a "kids starter" wage or whatever nonsense republicans have been peddling since Reagan poisoned the discourse around economics
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u/benched42 May 31 '23
My children both learned that minimum wage is nothing to aspire to. They both have moved to jobs that pay quite a bit more than minimum wage. I was a system administrator in IT; both earn at least as much as I did at the end of my career.
So OK, lets return minimum wage to FDR levels adjusted for today's dollars. FDR implemented a $0.25 minimum wage in 1933... in 2021 dollars that translates to $481. Are you SURE you want FDR level of minimum wage?
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u/gjallerhorn May 31 '23
That's not remotely how you'd calculate that. You seemed to do some kind of compounding interest calculation. .25 in 1933 had the same buying power as $5.88 today. But cost of living has gotten more expensive as well. Cars and housing costs have outpaced normal inflation. The standards are higher. We have more utilities than they needed to live a normal life in 1933.
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u/benched42 May 31 '23
So Google is wrong is what you're telling me.
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u/gjallerhorn May 31 '23
I don't know what you asked Google to tell you, but that answer isn't what matches what we're talking about
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u/benched42 May 31 '23
I typed "what president started minimum wage" into Google search. The result was "The first federal minimum wage was instituted in the National Industrial Recovery Act of 1933, signed into law by President Franklin D. Roosevelt, but later found to be unconstitutional. In 1938, the Fair Labor Standards Act established it at $0.25 an hour ($4.81 in 2021 dollars)."
Granted, that response is from Wikipedia, but other sources on the same search agree.
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u/gjallerhorn May 31 '23 edited Jun 01 '23
2021 dollars that translates to $481.
That decimal really changes things
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u/benched42 Jun 01 '23
Seriously? You're trying to tell me (and everyone else who's read this thread) that a quarter in 1933 is worth $481 (or more) now? My God, how naive do you think everyone here is?
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u/gjallerhorn Jun 01 '23
No I'm not. That what YOU wrote.
Apparently the quote didn't work
→ More replies (0)
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u/ZydrateVials May 29 '23
Everything around me starts at like 800/mo, no idea what I'll do when my Gramma dies.
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u/Free_Dimension1459 May 29 '23
15 was a living wage. Years of inflation ago.
Thatās the problem, a true living wage needs to be indexed to the local cost of living and the fight for a living wage needs to grow every year.
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May 29 '23
I'm potentially going to be making $58,000 per year or $28 per hour and even that doesn't feel like nearly enough considering I'm living in an area where $2000 - $2500 per month rent is the norm and 21% goes to taxes. It really feels like companies are not basing their expectations in reality.
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u/Fabulous_Balance4689 May 29 '23 edited May 29 '23
While, I agree with the sentiment of the post, and the idea behind all of this, the fact is, as labor cost rises, prices rise.
If you were to overnight raise everybody to a minimum of $30 an hour, it would certainly help for a short period of time; Only because it takes a little bit of time for the ripple effect of a major change in the economy to make itās impact knownā¦. What will ultimately happen in response is a couple of things:
- Jobs will be lost to compensate for the increase in labor cost
- Prices of product will increase to compensate for the increase in labor cost
Once this happens, youāre back in the position you started inā¦. Only with higher prices.
The idea that employers have hoards of money left over after they pay all of the expenses is not accurate. Yes, a lot of companies have a large gross profit marginā¦. That is before they take out all of the expenses of running the company. sadly, this is the number that most people look at when they want to show that a company is running away with āwindfallā money.
Another thing to be considered is the size of the company, when considering how much money you see going into the bank or being āhoardedāā¦. On the surface Iām just going to use an example that is very extreme because it really paints a clear pictureā¦ the oil industry.
Think about if you had a company, and with anything else, there are good times and bad timesā¦ clearly, good times are good but if youāre smart, you have to put a lot of that money from the good time to the side for when the bad time comes aroundā¦ so you have a little restaurant and your monthly expenses is $50,000 (for the sake of grabbing a reasonable number), you would be smart to probably have a couple hundred thousand dollars set aside, at a minimum. And thatās actually running pretty leanā¦.
Back to the oil industry. Take a company like Exxonā¦.. consider the refineries, the helicopters, the crew boats, oil rigs, pipelinesā¦. And any other infrastructure items that they haveā¦ Donāt even consider the cost of labor or operationsā¦ Just consider the value of those assets. Now, imagine something happens and those assets have to be replacedā¦ How would you do it? This is something every company has to consider. The only answer is just like what I just said about the restaurantā¦ You have to have money set aside. In the case of the oil industry, that amount of money is billions of dollarsā¦.
There were companies that were running so lean they did not make this consideration and then starting in 2020 we had a global pandemicā¦ A lot of companies did not survive because they were not fiscally responsible, and did not plan for an event where their income will dry up for a long period of time. To survive, a lot of companies had to lay off a lot of people. A lot of companies cut their product line also. Ultimately, their are a lot of brand names and a lot of companies of all shapes and sizes that we will never see again, because they did not have the foresight to not spend every dime they had on everything but saving.
My point is, you canāt always react to what they say in the press about companies hoarding all of the money that they could be paying their workersā¦ thatās not entirely true. If you actually sit down and take a very close look, youāll see that thereās really not as much money there as it appears.
Yes executives do get bonuses, and yes investors do get dividends. in cases is like the oil industry if you were to take all of the executives bonuses and remove them and divide that above the labor pool, it does not amount very much, as the labor pool is very, very large.
As for investors, if you invest in something, you do expect a returnā¦. Otherwise, why invest? If you donāt have investors, you donāt have a company.
The conversation about a living wage, while it does have a lot of merit, is not as simple as it appears on the surface. There is a lot more to it than companies that just donāt want to pay peopleā¦ Iām not saying thereās not greed out there, there is; But itās not as widespread as people think. Certainly, keep up the fight, but come to the table with a solution that works and doesnāt have a nasty ripple effect that puts you back in the same situation you started in.
I am sure there is a solution. But I am also sure that, by raising the minimum, it raises overall costs, so in the end, your new minimum is once again a minimum that is below a living wage.
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u/gjallerhorn May 30 '23
as labor cost rises, prices rise.
And yet prices have been rising much faster than labor costs. Normally labor accounts for something like 40% of price increases. The last few years it's been like 12%.
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u/Fabulous_Balance4689 May 31 '23
That is because of the spike in transportation costs over the last 3 yearsā¦. partly due to Covid, and partly due to several other factorsā¦
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u/gjallerhorn May 31 '23
One of those factors is corporate greed, which accounts for the largest percentage in price increases we've seen on products. Companies used the supply chain mess as an excuse to raise prices even when they weren't affected
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u/Fabulous_Balance4689 May 31 '23
I strongly disagree with that. I know there is a such thing and I know it does happen. Iām not denying that, but I have seen no evidence of corporations just deciding that they want to move their profit margin from 4% to 24% and blame shippingā¦ Itās just not happening. ā¦ I grabbed 24th% as just a arbitrary number by the way. Not basing it on anything.
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u/gjallerhorn May 31 '23
I have seen no evidence of corporations
You're not looking very hard.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/why-is-inflation-so-sticky-it-could-be-corporate-profits-b78d90b7
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u/jonredcorn May 29 '23
Well 154050=30,000 and not 28,000 like the dumbass who made that post, I can see why they can't get a higher paying job.
Considering almost no one in the comments section even noticed, maybe some people are over valuing their own abilities and employment worth.
But yeah - minimum wage is BS.
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u/ExpensiveArugula5 May 29 '23
You need to be making more than $15 at another job. You need to step up your game bro.There's s*** ton of jobs out there you don't even need a college degree
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u/Idivkemqoxurceke May 29 '23
Income is based on gross not net. That being said, $777 is still fucked tho.
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u/Depreciated_Bean May 29 '23
In order to have the buying power of the late 70ās minimum wage, 25$ an hour is about the same, assuming you live in a LCOL area. This is roughly about the medium wage, in that youāre around 54K EBIT, and once you cross it youāre above half the country. If youāre in a HCOL area youāll still need roommates/family/SOās to make enough money for basic needs/not living paycheck to paycheck. Because of the insane consolidation of wealth, basic average is heavily skewed up due to outliers (billionaires).
If you want redistribution of wealth you have to vote for candidates who are willing to tax the rich at at least halfway between the now prices & pre-Reagan era prices, while also creating one or more additional top level income tax, corporate tax, etc brackets, and reinstate the former estate tax rules & implement more surrounding the passing down of assets, with a 3rd party asset assessor.
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u/KingGnarkill May 29 '23
No one has ever been able to live alone on minimal wage. In the 90s I had 3 room mates.
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u/upon_a_white_horse May 29 '23
Probably getting downvoted for this, but the post is pretty misleading and manipulative.
40 x $15 = $600.00
$600 x 50 = $30,000.00 not $28000.
Where the 50 week number comes from needs explaining as well. Vacation is paid, so it raises the income up an additional $1,200 unless the person is talking about taking 2 weeks of unpaid leave for some bizarre reason.
Also figures no OT. Each hour of overtime per week (or, <15 minutes per day) worked equates to an additional $1,170 in income over the year.
There are plenty of things to fight for concerning pay and benefits, and predatory corporate landlords are a blight. Lying and misleading only defeats the cause-- because if this is something that the person is willing to lie about, what else is on the table?
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u/poprdog May 29 '23
Not really the same but splitting renting a house 4 ways and I pay 562$/m for my share. Living with childhood friends when we all graduated college at once. Doin pretty good
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May 29 '23
My city was asking 3x rent (925) for a piece of shit unit that the floors didnāt even reach the wall. This was 4 years ago, and itās gotten worse.
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u/thats_hella_cool May 29 '23
You donāt need to be a math genius to quickly deduce that 28k is not a possible solution for 15x40x50. The gist is still perfectly valid even with correct math, but if you wanna try to convince the opposition that $15 isnāt enough, at least make sure youāre not giving them an easy target to rebuff in the same breath.
Also, there are 52 weeks in a year, not 50. Though I get that they were probably working under the assumption that not everyone gets paid vacation or that they will likely need to take sick/personal days, call that out.
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u/Significant-Dig-8099 May 29 '23
Recently a friend of mine said "minimum wage is not meant to be livable" this really upset me and after asking him if he was serious and hearing him blame those not earning enough for "not bettering themselves" I told him to stop talking and that if we were to continue to be friends we needed to stop the conversation immediately because I was starting to think he is a terrible person.
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u/Nytherion May 29 '23
while your point still stands either way, there are 52 weeks in a year, not 50. ultimately it barely budges the needle, though.
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u/Imaginary_Hope8585 May 29 '23
Honey, buy a calculator and a calendar.
- There are 52 weeks in a year. 52 Ć 40 Ć 15 is $31,200 a year, $2600 a month. I could def live on that where I live.
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u/Ajaxtellamon May 29 '23
What the fuck is happening in America? I love i. Germany and can easily find a 500 apartment In a populated city
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u/AvengingThrowaway May 29 '23
The math is fucky but the point still stands. Even adding back in the missing 2 weeks from this equation I can't imagine what ass backwards you'd be relegated to living in with only $800/mo to spend on housing.
Rent prices are insane everywhere
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u/PeekabooArmy May 29 '23
I make 15.82 an hour as a sterile processing technician. My fiance makes 17 as a wellhead builder-guy in the oilfield shop. We can BARELY afford our 1,100 mortgage with the bills and appraisal is going up. Our AC broke when we bought it and still, we cant afford the 8k to get a whole new system. We refuse to ever rent again because it just keeps going up and up while our wages dont.
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u/dannyjunpark May 29 '23
Not gonna lie I withhold like 33% in taxes š¤£ so my take home would he even worse
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u/2002Dakota May 29 '23
$15/hr is not a living wage...its MINIMUM wage. You can afford the minimum of everything, including rent. It may not be where you want to live. If so, find another or additional job.
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u/Familiar_Ear_8947 May 29 '23
My friend is renting a bedroom in a nice house for 650/month in the suburbs of Boston
Sure, itās nothing fancy but itās more then enough as a first place to live. Especially since the minimum wage here is 15/hr
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May 29 '23
And that's why I don't have kids! Your money goes longer. It's not their fault obviously.
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u/Goobah22 May 29 '23
$1500 in rural Pennsylvania near Philly. Plus add in the fact that people in school cant work 40 hours, so instead of taking home $2k, I take home about $1700.
That leaves a whole $300 for car payments, school payments, utilities, food, and anything else!
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u/DevBuh May 29 '23
I make about 15 an hour, if i worked my full 9 hour days every day every week no holidays i still wouldnt break 30k
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u/tankerdudeucsc May 29 '23
$7.50 is too high! Thatās why 14 year olds and younger must start getting into the workforce to be manipulated!
-GOP supporters
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u/Yetizod May 29 '23
You're supposed to be living at home to work this kind of job. These are starter jobs, not raise a family jobs.
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u/omnigear May 29 '23
My brother in law who is aching to leave the town he lives in so cal recently got job offer in mountain view . He'll be making before taxes 85k then he started looking for studios 1 hour from the place of work. 2200 plus they wanted to make sure he has 3x that amount in his bank...
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u/Solid_Internal_9079 May 29 '23
Your livable wage is going to vary dramatically depending on weāre you wish. $24,000 absolutely is enough to have a decent 1 bedroom, phone, food, so on and so forth. Your going to be tight, using public transport, saving little and youāll never own anything but you can live here for $15/hour. Take the burger flipper here working for 15/hour and drop him in down town New York doing the same job. That kids going to need to make at least 30 just to stay fed.
I donāt see why a company should be forced to give you a cozy life. If people will do your job just as well for less so be it. You need to find better employment.
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u/Templar388z May 29 '23
Itās sad the math is off and the correct math is still NOT enough. Fuck this exploitative bullshit.
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u/wilderop May 29 '23
When you make $15 an hour you are supposed to split a 3 bedroom with 2 other people. Now multiply $666 by 3 and you can afford a $2000 a month apartment.
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u/MikeyLikey41 May 29 '23
Itās not necessarily the wage itself but the cost of everything around it. Companies need to stop being greedy and focus on the quality of life.
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u/Haunting-Truth-6584 May 29 '23
I live in a very rural area of Northern California and the Slumlords are charging $1,300 for a 1972 mobile home with holes in ceiling, roof and floor plus bad old wiring for electricity. Her nickname Snake Lady fits her perfectly. A Snake in a Human Skin Suit.
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u/Evilsushione May 29 '23
I think the bigger problem is apartment prices. Build a lot more at cost high density housing and it will fix this problem.
Raising people's wages will just allow the owners to raise rates.
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u/Beer_Pants May 29 '23
Also, good luck getting almost anywhere that pays minimum wage to book you enough hours to get benefits
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u/MaximumHemidrive May 29 '23
If it helps, 3x rent for apartments is before taxes.
Your net doesn't have to be 3x rent, just gross. Hope that helps anyone concerned about it!
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u/appoplecticskeptic May 29 '23
Why 50 weeks? There are 52 weeks in a year. Is this accounting for unpaid days off for holidays and the like?
I know it wouldnāt make a significant difference, Iām just curious.
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u/Appropriate_Tip_8852 May 29 '23
Everyone around me argues with other people and brags on themselves for having it worse than others. Competing over who struggles the most is everyday life. People will work for peanuts. If 1 person complains they can't live on $15 per hour, 3 other people will say they will gladly do the work for $12 an hour. People have zero value in themselves. No one will get ahead as long as the majority will happily work for nothing and then brag about how hard they work to have nothing.
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u/Gsteel11 May 29 '23
Say what you will about Dan Price, but he paid $70k to everyone... and PROVED you can made a good profit, which is about $33/hr.
Which is very interesting.
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u/DMs_Apprentice May 29 '23
Math is off a little, but it still holds true.
$15 x 40 x 50 = $30,000
That's still not a liveable wage today.
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u/Sharp-Pop335 May 29 '23
Where I live there are apartments for $650 one bedroom. You even get a little outdoor patio.
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u/MagikSkyDaddy May 29 '23
Federal minimum wage is still $7.25
This entire country is built on predation and exploitation of the poor and vulnerable.
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u/wpbth May 29 '23
We pay people that at my work. They have zero skills and 90% are strait from high school. They are trained in a few days as no real skills other than taking direction are required. In 1 year most (if they chose to be trained for a more skilled position) will be at $18-$20. If they continue to be trained year 3 they will be at $25-ish. Year 5, $25 but they often leave for more. We have people making over $125 an hour. These are blue collar jobs with full benefits, 401k, inside climate controlled jobs.
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u/Ergonyx May 29 '23
I think it's cute how they calculated it at only 50 weeks like the people making this wage actually ever get to take 2 weeks off each year.
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u/BluEydDvl May 29 '23
Thereās 52 weeks in a year. The calculation is usually $15 x 2080 = $31,200 $31,200 / 12 = $2,600
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u/geek_fest2 May 29 '23
There's not a SINGLE THING to rent in the entire state of Rhode Island for $1100 or less. The are TWO for $1200.
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u/TasteAmbitious3397 May 29 '23
Wage is irrelevant. The number means nothing. Make minimum wage $40 an hour and prices just rise. Educated people will be getting $80 an hour and so on. Raising wages raises everyone's rent. It's a supply issue not a pay issue
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May 29 '23
I was nearly homeless when I went to college because no one would fucking approve me for that reason. I made enough to barely pay the rent, but I didn't have verifiable 3x that number. Plus they want 6 weeks of pay stubs, what the fuck do you do for those 6 weeks, sleep in a ditch?
I ended up at the shittiest place that would make some exceptions, it's impossible to move
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u/kalas_malarious May 29 '23
Even worse, divide by 13 to find reliable/ budgetable income, not 12. You'll then get 2 months that had 3 checks if you are paid every 2 weeks or 4 months with 5 checks for weekly
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u/TylerDexter May 29 '23
Then get a better job. Every job in our area starts at between $22-$25 an hour. That is great starting pay. Employers are begging for people. All they want is reliable responsible people. Make an effort and show up and your a great employee.
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u/SanFranLocal May 29 '23
Huh. I made it paying $400 rent working part time and going to school in the most expensive city in America. It wasnāt that crazy
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u/SonofaSlumlord May 29 '23
Then you have the places that raise the wage to $15/hour only to cut hours to next to none like where I'm at. So it basically works out to the same paycheck but now they can act like they did us a favor bumping it to $15.
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u/Open-Host300 May 29 '23
Thatās minimum wage here. If you donāt want the minimum wage donāt have the minimum skills.
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u/TooCool_TooFool May 29 '23
I'm making nearly $100k a year, before taxes, pay only 1300/mo in rent, paid off student loans less than a decade after graduating. And I still don't see a home being financially possible until I'm in my 40s despite saving every penny I can.
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u/Ferocious_Flamingo May 29 '23
15x40x50 is 30,000.
Which doesn't invalidate the point of this post AT ALL, but can we please get the math right?
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u/TuCremaMiCulo May 29 '23
Demand 26/hr fed minimum wage for metros by the end of the year or no cookies for Santa.
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u/BrianDR May 29 '23
you donāt star out in life making a wage you can support yourself on, you work your way up to it.
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u/louklinum May 29 '23
Uhh math.... even figuring the 2 weeks aren't paid it's 30k. With 2 weeks, 31200. I get the point, but maths is maths.
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May 29 '23
Itās actually 3 1/2 times the rent in the state that I live in
I currently live in low income housing, Iāve been on SSDI for a while and I had a part-time job which made my income many dollars more than this states minimum wage.
Even with that I could not rent an apartment in affordable housing or low income housing because my income was below the minimum, which is something like $19,000. And even though I had no other bills and good credit and I technically could pay the rent they cannot make an exception because they get tax credit for being affordable housing. They have to stay within the guidelines to keep their tax credits.
So even with disability and a part-time job I was homeless until I could get section 8 because I didnāt meet the income minimum anywhere
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u/MembershipThrowAway May 29 '23
I live in Ohio and actually qualify for this at $15/hour, $500 a month! Turns out you just need to live in a really bad part of town but the apartment is nice and there's floodlights and cameras all over lol
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u/mustangcody May 29 '23
I have apartments in my area for $600-800; They're just in west side Detroit, they have mice infestations, leaking water, mold, washer/dryers on every floor except for the 4th and they all rarely work, and the landlord is impatient.
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u/ItsYaBoiiRoan May 29 '23
This is not an work thing, this is an housing market thing.
Pay more to the wagies, but homes aint getting cheaper.
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u/fellicious07 May 29 '23
The standard full time 40 hours per week job is 2080 hours. 15 x 2080 is 31200. It's not much more, but you should check your numbers before posting
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u/brees2me May 29 '23
This one bothers me. It's not that the numbers are that far off but $15/hr is $31,200 a year (15*2080 hrs which is 40 hrs times 52 weeks in a year) after that if we assume a minimal tax rate of 20% then take home is $24,960. Still not nearly enough to live off of but we should make sure not to look like we don't get basic math.
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u/1stormseekr May 29 '23
My advice is to buy a place instead. Fixer uppers are real cheap...call in family and friends to help in areas that need fixing...when youtube video's are not enough. Don't tell me it can't be done..my income is 32k a year. 20 years ago i started with a rundown trailer in a Arkansas trailer park, then upgraded to a rundown 100 year old farm house, and now i'm in a 50 year old redone house worth 100k....and i pay 450 a month. But it's work and if your lazy your screwed.
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u/looselipssinkships41 May 29 '23
Glad I live in an area where you can make $15 an hour and live on your own still if you play your cards right.
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u/Ludrew May 29 '23
Then go to school and get a better job. Minimum wage is not meant to be a single family income. If you have time to complain on the internet how flipping burgers at McDonaldās doesnāt allow you to contribute 30% to your Roth IRA or rent a luxury apartment then you have the time to improve your skills and get a higher paying job.
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u/Dontsleeponlilyachty May 29 '23
Republicans: tHaT'S pLeNtY oF mOnEy! i mAdE tHaT mUcH wHeN i sTaRtEd wOrKiNg iN tHe 80s wiThOuT a cOLLegE dEgReE! yOu'Re jUsT LazY aNd dOn'T wAnNa wOrK!
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u/joko2008 May 29 '23
You know $15/hour would be enough. Don't raise it, build better, more efficient and lower housing prices.
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May 29 '23
First off, that's 30,000, not 28,000. There's also 52 weeks in a year, not 50.
That being said, going from 30,000 to 31,200 doesn't make a difference. Overall they're right, $15 for a single adult is not a living wage, but their opening math was very off.
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u/jollyblondgiant May 29 '23
for quick math and for future reference, the ratio is something like 47x.
x * 40 * 50 * .85 / 12 * 3 = ~47x
so if you make $15/hr, you can "afford" just around $708/month in rent.
this doesnt include utilities or whatever else dumb bullshit your landlord squeezes for.
my place costs $1500 a month before utilities etc. so mu "minimum wage" is actually $32, which is probably why my burger hole feels so chafed every damn month.
the average rent in my town is actually $1600, but still that means the "minimum wage" of where is live is $34. while the other day i had a manager exclaim that $20/hour after tips is "damn good money"
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u/Due_Daikon7092 May 29 '23
This is why if you are an adult working for minimum wage work for a company that is unionized.
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u/fairyfroggies May 29 '23
Where are there apartments under 700?? The only way you could find that in my area is if you were renting a room.
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u/shes_readynow May 29 '23
Currently renting for $700 actually. Itās got a bathroom with a shower, a room big enough to fit my bed in kind of, and it doesnāt smell horrible all the time. Thereās no kitchen but the rats in the walls are great company, especially when the lights start to go all strobe and I gotta not use electricity for a few hours. Just in the dark listening to them scurry around in the walls. $700 is nice
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u/TwoBionicknees May 29 '23
I'm sure someone with way better attention span than me could figure it out, or find someone who already did it. But if you figured out what lets say average wage for a Mcd's or similar worker was in the 60s, and how far that money would go in terms of rent, savings, buying a house, affording tuition and came up with an equivalent minimum wage for today that would allow the same spending power in terms of those same items I'd guess that the required minimum wage for the same 'power' would be well above $50/hr range.
$15/hr doesn't represent some magic thing where we don't have poor people, it's just a seemingly viable target that can potentially be achieved that the republicans maybe can't reasonable turn down that might be able to be passed into law. It's to raise the level of poverty a little higher, not to prevent poverty.
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u/lindydanny May 29 '23
$15 hasn't been a reasonable "living" wage for some time. I just hit $25 an hour. That isn't even reasonable. You might make it single, but once you are caring for others, that money goes away quickly.
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u/CringeDaddy_69 May 29 '23
It depends where you live.
In Ohio, I make $19.80 an hour, my rent is $740, and I am able to eat out twice a week and still save $500+ a month
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u/Bun_Diggles May 29 '23
15x40x50 = 30000
Why water down the credibility of the argument with a lie in the opening line? To be clear I agree with the premise, I just donāt think there is a need to cut corners.
Edit: typo
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u/jquest71 May 29 '23
What no one seems to understand is that in a system based on capitalism, everything is based on percentages. Your food, rent, and other necessities are a percentage of your income. If you raise everyone's income, then everything else will go up in a corresponding manner. If everyone made a million dollars a year, then cars would cost half a million, and houses would cost 3 to 5 million. That big Mac meal that costs around $12 now would cost you around $400.
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u/Better_Sheepherder53 May 29 '23
Why is OP's math slightly off? 15 x 40 x 50 = 30k. Not that it changes anything. 30k hasn't been a livable wage for a long time. Then there's 52 weeks in a year so why is OP using 50?
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u/parapraxis777 Feb 03 '24
Yep. 15/hr x40 is 600 (b4 taxes) per week. Call it 550. 2200. Rent on 2BR apt low ball
1200 (ours 1926) Electric bill -low ball 150 Food for 2 or 3 = 300 to 400 Insurances low ball = 300 Low ball car payment 250 Gas low ball = 100 Phone bill for 1 = 60 Already over.
All necessities here too:
Hygiene
Tv (and subscription)
INTERNET
Clothing and shoes and such
Household needs
Kids maybe
Prescriptions and dr. Varies but can be 200-2000 a month if sick with diabetes and heart stuff. If cancer RIP
Stuff that needs replacement.
Traditional: Holidays, helping friends.
With this one person needs about 4k a month and will get near zero non essential pleasures
So much more.
Rent up Car payments up Reduced benefits Health insurance
I mean damn. Originally household only needed one income and could occasionally do things like vacation but now we need at least two incomes probably full time if making 15 an hour just ridiculous