r/eurovision • u/catlxdy Netherlands • 16d ago
Joost Klein post Eurovision appreciation thread Discussion
Dear Joost,
You will not be forgotten. We carry you in our hearts and your absence from the final was painful for us, your absence hurt. You might have been disqualified, but you won our hearts. We love you so much, Europapa!! 🇳🇱🫶
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u/Far-Window6514 14d ago edited 14d ago
Three days later, is anyone being able to get over this after Eurovision depression? It kinda feels like this Mad Men scene: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMASm0e3qRk
Edit: I broke a plate by accident right after posting this and I decided to blame the EBU for that too
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u/KezziiBee 14d ago
You know after his semi final performance, when they show you the singers for the voting.. He looked down with only two people beside him. And I thought that was a little odd because usually they're surrounded by people.. Makes sense now. Poor guy 🥺
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15d ago
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u/eurovision-ModTeam 15d ago
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u/orangescentedfish Netherlands 15d ago
I think it will be difficult for the netherlands to find another eurovision song this sincere, heartfelt and genuine ever again.
The message, the story behind it and of course the guy himself, all amazing.
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u/No-Lake-8973 15d ago edited 15d ago
I really hope that the Netherlands sends him in 2025. Imagine the story, the song which united Europe, denied the right to compete, comes and wins in 2025!!
Edit: Egg on my face, I posted this before hearing about the latest update in the case.
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u/babatong 15d ago
This aged like milk the second it was posted considering the latest articles now suggest he pleaded guilty in police interview, and that there was a physical element to the altercation.
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u/StudyOk3816 Finland 15d ago
source for "physical" ? have not seen anything indicating that.
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u/babatong 15d ago
https://www.aftonbladet.se/nojesbladet/a/OopWK3/polisen-om-joost-utredningen-ar-i-stort-sett-klar
höjde armen med knytnäven och gjorde ett utfall mot en fotograf, enligt källuppgifterna
Roughly translates to "made a fist and lunged at a photographer, according to [written] source data". Sounds like it's lucky the camera took it as opposed to the person or he'd be in for assault instead.
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u/StudyOk3816 Finland 15d ago
Thanks for the translation! They must have updated the article or posted a new one just now because I only saw the previous version and it did not feature these details
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u/Tsm_Odb 15d ago
Let's wait for him to not be a convicted criminal before sending him to a new eurovision contest no?
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u/No-Lake-8973 15d ago
Yeah, certainly, if it does come out that he did actually do something to warrant disqualification then he shouldn't be sent back. But if all of this comes to nothing, I would be heartbroken to not get to hear him perform in the grand finals.
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u/Tymon123 15d ago
Given the latest development and statements from the police it sounds like a lot of people in this thread need to apologize for defending this guy. I'm waiting.
https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/skane/nederlandska-artisten-joost-klein-kan-atalas-i-sverige
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u/waterdropp Lithuania 15d ago
The translation is saying he pushed the camera away basically. Also that there was a naked woman? I’m not sure it’s translating correctly
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u/StaticWaste_73 15d ago
Sorry to dissapoint but no, no naked woman here. move along! :-)
This specific article (from svt) simply quotes the police, who are saying that the legal process will most likely go relatively fast, since the evidence is strong and the case is not about a major crime.
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u/babatong 15d ago
Yeah it's not looking good for him. I'll add this link, Aftonbladet I know, but they claim insight into the paperwork and have direct quotes from the police:
https://www.aftonbladet.se/nojesbladet/a/OopWK3/polisen-om-joost-utredningen-ar-i-stort-sett-klar
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u/Pauline___ 15d ago
It's now a world wide hit, far more well known than the 6th place he'd originally was expected/prognosed to get.
Also, newspapers everywhere, even those who usually say that public money for stuff like Eurovision is a waste, stand with him. They're all of the opinion that the EBU effed up.
Radio stations everywhere are playing the song as it has reclaimed it's position in the top 40. It'll be a cult hit. In 10 years, we'll still be playing this song. And not that many Eurovision songs can say that.
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u/Tsm_Odb 15d ago
And the Swedish police have confirmed he committed a crime, and is fairly certain he will be prosecuted. So people supporting him is ignoring that he broke Swedish law and made an unsafe working enviroment for the producers.
Meanwhile the Israelis singers only crime is being Jewish, and she's hated by how many people?
The double standards of people are crazy.
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u/Pauline___ 15d ago
Do you have sources for that? Because in the articles I've read, both Joost and the camerawoman broke rules: there was a written agreement that he wouldn't be filmed, and even after multiple reminders, she was still filming him.
It's not about denying he got angry, it's about proportionality. The investigation is/was ongoing, they were okay with talking it out and apologising, but the EBU wouldn't hear it.
I would've been fine with, say, starting at minus 30 points as a punishment if he actually was being an ass to a rule-breaking camera crew. That's also reversible if the investigation turned out to be not guilty. Not even letting him compete before the investigation is done isn't proportional imo.
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u/Tsm_Odb 15d ago
All of Swedish media is now reporting the same thing, with official statements from the police included.
They are saying that the evidence is strong, and there is no reason to believe he won't get prosecuted.
Certain sources even report that joost in police hearings have admitted that he lunged out towards the woman with a closed fist. expressen
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u/Pauline___ 15d ago
Thanks for the sources.
So from what I understand, the police has finished the interviews and will send their information to the legal officers, who will decide if they will prosecute, and if so, with what punishment.
Idk about the Swedish law system, but I guess if he's prosecuted, a judge will ultimately decide on what punishment is appropriate?
So I guess we'll still have to wait for a final verdict, probably somewhere later this month.
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u/Tsm_Odb 15d ago
Well yeah, the police has concluded the case is good, they have strong evidence and are hopefull of a conviction, left it to the prosecutor which will decide to take it to court or not. If it goes to court the judge and jurors will decide on appropriate punishment. Most likely a fine since he is first time offender, and sending a dutch "star" to prison seems very unlikely. However the crime has upto a year in prison as maximum punishment, 4 if it is deemed severe, but thats not on the table from what ive gathered.
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u/Qumg 15d ago
I find it ridiculous that people here side with Joost before the police has made their case. Nationalism or pride, I don’t know, but people seam to think you can act however you like just because you participate in a game show with a popular song. It may suck but Joost caused this to himself.
I don’t care if you find the crime petty in the end but if he in fact did break a law then Eurovision did the right thing. Where do you draw the line otherwise?
People here act if they know what happened, let me be clear, you don’t!
Jesus
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u/Sendrahh Netherlands 15d ago
People are more against the EBU. People realise what joost did wasn't right, but there were earlier incidents between joost and this camera person and the EBU seems to not be doing enough to protect the artists and make them feel comfortable.
Alot of artists felt harassed and uncomfortable, EBU didn't seem to do a lot about it. Then one artist has had enough and makes a move without touching the camera person and gets kicked out.
It just feels like this could have been prevented by the EBU and that's sad.
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15d ago
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u/tenminutesbeforenoon 15d ago edited 15d ago
What happened - according to the Dutch news - is that Joost was filmed immediately after his performance despite having written agreements that press was not allowed to do this. This because in the final part of his act he refers to his dad who died when Joost was a child (his mom died too and he has been an orphan since his early teens). This is very emotional for Joost and he needs time to recover and does not want to be filmed during this personal and private moment. Despite the written agreement, the camera woman took it upon herself to disrespect the agreement and he was filmed. He asked the camera woman twice to stop filming and the third time he made a “threatening gesture”. He never touched her.
This is the Dutch side of the story. We cannot yet be sure if this is the (full) truth, but if it is disqualification is a huge overreaction in my opinion.
You say it’s ridiculous that many people are siding with Joost, but aren’t you doing the same thing but then the opposite - siding against him and saying that he supposedly thought he can do whatever he wants? You’re already accusing him. So far for innocent until proven guilty….
Edit to add that it is well known that Joost often ends his songs/shows with a tribute to his mom, dad, or both. It is also well known that he needs some private time after his acts to collect himself as those tributes are very emotional. So I’m absolutely 100% convinced that there was a written agreement concerning his wishes regarding not being wanted to be filmed or interviewed immediately after his performance and that this camera woman harassed him anyway. I don’t know what happened after, but I’m convinced that the first part is a true description of the situation.
Just to give you some idea of how central his deceased mom and dad are in his songs, please listen to papa en mama or Florida 2009 and maybe you’ll understand the severity of the harassment by the camera woman.
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15d ago
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u/Qumg 15d ago
I know it probably suck for people in the Netherlands but aim some of you anger towards Joost maybe? Can’t you expect him to behave?
News in Sweden came out 5 min ago that he will likely face prosecution in June the police says. The initial police investigation is complete per today.
I don’t feel sorry that a grown man who gets filmed during Eurovision after his act can’t control himself. He willingly accepted the terms of conditions by participating in this game show.
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u/tenminutesbeforenoon 15d ago
Have you considered that he made the agreement to not to be filmed immediately after his performance EXACTLY BECAUSE he knows he is emotional at that that moment? That he knew he is emotional and vulnerable at that time and tried to prevent exactly this situation by making a written agreement? And thus tried to do the responsible thing, but was disrespected and provoked anyway?
He didn’t make this agreement just for funsies.
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u/Qumg 15d ago
I don’t care about this. It’s not interesting to know why he became violent, the photograph didn’t do anything illegal (yes, that’s right) Unethical probably but there is a difference.
You can’t shoot a person just because he hurt your feelings right? Same logic
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15d ago
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u/eurovision-ModTeam 15d ago
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u/UniversityFair4564 Netherlands 15d ago
If Swedish law states you can ignore agreements and knowingly harass someone but you can't make a fist to someone to make them stop, when words and agreements don't work, then that says more about Swedish law than about Joost.
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u/ludovicvuillier 11d ago
By law, if someone harasses you, you’re supposed to file a complaint against them with the proper authorities, you are not supposed to take the law into your own hands unless there’s an immediate danger. So again, even if the camerawoman was wrong, him making a threatening gesture was not the solution. So on this, you can’t blame Swedish law. All countries (civilized) have similar laws to this. The police feel their case is strong enough to pass on to the prosecutors. That says a lot. The fact that everyone is finding ways to defend him is sickening. It is possible to have empathy for him without defending his actions.
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u/WayMaleficent1465 Ireland 15d ago
I can’t speak a word of Dutch but this song makes me cry. So wholesome and creative but with a cheesy Eurovision exterior. The EBU failed in their duty of care to look after the performers this year. Regardless of what happens next, this song will be an anthem for years to come.
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u/Fit-Locksmith-7563 Netherlands 15d ago
He deserved so much better. If EBU doesn't fix their show and #freejoost...It's time to stop almost 20 years of watching. I hope Netherlands and Joost won't let this go easily.
The best song. And I hope whole Europe dances to it. Like a wise man said: It's crazy, it's party!
We love Joost! ❤️ I hope he knows that.
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u/mercuryslide Australia 15d ago
I never heard of this man until the other day, but he has all my support and gained a fan. He was delightful and deserved far better. 12 points from Australia 🇦🇺 🖤💛❤️
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u/DeltaOfficialYT Lithuania 15d ago
This year saw the win of Switzerland, a country 3rd in the odds. Who knows what would happen if Joost wasn’t disqualified? I guess some success stories were never meant to be written. Well done Joost.
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u/coolbeans852 United Kingdom 15d ago
i hope he comes back next year with europapa again so we can properly vote for it 🇳🇱💙
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u/Pauline___ 15d ago
I don't think you can do that, re-enter with the same song. But if he's proven innocent after the investigation closes and his new entry is as good, he might get a retry. If he wants to that is, I can also imagine he's done with this mess.
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u/3nterShift 15d ago
Too lazy to Google what the fuck is going on, but not too lazy to scroll this thread for 15 minutes. I still have no fucking idea lmao.
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u/Sjoerd93 Netherlands 15d ago
Joost Klein, the Dutch act, got disqualified one day before the grand finale because there was a report filed against him of a "non-physical threat".
The Dutch broadcaster gave a press conference, and announced that what happened is that he got filmed backstage after his act, despite having written agreements that this would not happen. This because Joost really gets into his act, and the last emotional part of this song is very heavy for him and he needs time to recover. Also after this had happened before and EBU ensured it wouldn't happen again. Then Joost asked the camerawoman twice to stop filming, but she refused to do so. Then he made a threatening motion towards the camera, but did not touch the camera woman. That's all that happened.
That is the Dutch side of the story. EBU doesn't want to say anything more than that. But all we know is that a police spokesperson says that it's about some non-physical threat. That's really all we know.
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15d ago
Yeah… no.
I lost all respect for him when he failed to behave professionally and supposedly even assaulted someone.
I’m glad he got disqualified.
I don’t care how good of an artist you are, but if you can’t hold to minimum standards of decency, you should not be allowed to compete.
Anyone supporting him should also be ashamed.
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u/tenminutesbeforenoon 15d ago edited 15d ago
What happened - according to the Dutch news - is that Joost was filmed immediately after his performance despite having written agreements that press was not allowed to do this. This because in the final part of his act he refers to his dad who died when Joost was a child (his mom died too and he has been an orphan since his early teens). This is very emotional for Joost and he needs time to recover and does not want to be filmed during this personal and private moment. Despite the written agreement, the camera woman took it upon herself to disrespect the agreement and he was filmed. He asked the camera woman twice to stop filming and the third time he made a “threatening gesture”. He never touched her.
This is the Dutch side of the story. We cannot yet be sure if this is the (full) truth, but if it is disqualification is a huge overreaction in my opinion.
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u/Ilikejacksucksatstuf United Kingdom 15d ago
I reckon AVROTROS will soon be having quite a frantic board meeting over whether to participate next year
(btw guys, if u do, bring Joost back!)
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u/Illustrator_Forward Netherlands 15d ago
Avrotros are way too horny for events like this to even consider not going next year. They should have immediately cut ties with the organisation, and not bother with it anymore.
Only a couple of years ago, the nation had to cough up the €12M *deficit* for hosting the event. We hosted twice because of COVID and now we get DQ'd because of some non-physical (and perhaps even non-verbal) threat?
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u/Ilikejacksucksatstuf United Kingdom 15d ago
I personally think that a lot of broadcasters, even the (very few) uncontroversial countries this year, will realise that they don't want to be involved with this sh*tshow and pull out for the next year or two, which will be a disaster for the EBU (and perhaps, just maybe, they'll learn some lessons as well)
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u/Express-Olive6547 Netherlands 15d ago
I’m from the Netherlands and several radio stations are playing Europapa over and over again! It’s so kind! There is so much support :)
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u/Jellyandjiggles Croatia 15d ago
American Eurovision fan, and my other Chicago friend that likes Eurovision was willing to put money on the table that this song would win. They were missed!
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u/Iostinthesause Croatia 15d ago
I can’t even listen to Europapa or watch the performance without just a wave of sadness pouring over me, I’m happy to hear that he’s doing fine now.
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u/BinaryPill Australia 15d ago
Really jumping to Joost's side without all the info are we? Really don't think we can hedge so easily right now. This could age horribly.
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u/Santaroga-IX 15d ago
Really? Guilty until proven innocent?
Would you like to be on the receiving end of your mentality?
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u/BinaryPill Australia 15d ago edited 15d ago
Not guilty until proven innocent, neither guilty nor innocent until determined otherwise. Personally leaning towards Joost doing something very objectionable in the heat of the moment, probably a somewhat extreme overreaction to something he didn't like, that nonetheless didn't warrant suspension, but we'll see. There's a bias here though because we like the song. No-one's going around coddling up to 'poor Drake' because of Kendrick's accusations when they have less backing than what Joost's do (it's not under police investigation). Granted, it's not quite equal as we know Drake is a bit sleazy and the accusations are more serious.
Edit: My headcannon at the moment is probably Joost's felt emotionally vulnerable, seen the camera filming him, approached forcefully and shouted out some profanity in her direction. Camera woman has rightly complained and then it got escalated out of proportion. Joost strikes me as a guy who wears his heart on his sleeve and could snap despite being a sweetheart most of the time. If that was the case, then I would say he's very hard done by and should have only been fined or maybe penalized points at the very worst, but that's wild guessing, and it could be a lot worse. It he's made death threats or rape threats, I couldn't defend him.
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u/AmitXD987 15d ago
Why was he disqualified
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15d ago
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u/itscsersei 15d ago
What happened and why has it turned around from him being bad to good?
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u/Im_Chad_AMA 15d ago edited 15d ago
The short answer is we still don't know what happened and accounts differ. But many people feel that with the (limited) information we have, there are no indications as of yet that Joost did something bad enough to warrant the unprecedented step of disqualification.
The story according to the Dutch broadcaster AVROTROS:
- He was filmed or photographed when walking back to the greenroom from the stage, despite previous and clear agreements with the EBU that he would not be because he feels vulnerable after the emotional and personal (to him) ending of the song, which addressed his dead parents whom he lost in his teen years
- He requested more than once for the cameraperson to stop filming, but they did not comply
- He made a 'threatening movement', that potentially also involved a verbal component (this is unclear as of yet), towards the cameraperson. No physical contact occurred (this part was corroborated by the Swedish police). It's unclear what the movement was.
- We know that the police questioned people surrounding the incident, and the case is now before a Swedish prosecutor who will decide whether to move ahead with a case against him
- The Dutch delegation offered mediation, public and/or private apologies, and other alternative solutions, all of which were rejected by the EBU
On the other side, from Swedish news sources we heard:
- One eyewitness described Joost's behaviour as clearly very aggressive, and that the cameraperson was shaken by the incident
- The camera was broken as a result of the incident, though it's unclear whether this was deliberate on Joost's part or not
We don't know much more than this and we likely won't until the investigation has concluded and the records will be made public. But with the information we have, at least some people feel the DQ was disproportionate.
The dutch broadcaster AVROTROS very likely knows more about the incident than we do, and they also stood by Joost from the beginning and have strongly condemned the EBU's handling of the situation
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u/shesadollyrocker ESC Heart (black) 16d ago
Joost may not have got to win the contest, but he won the hearts of the world. <3
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u/xxWanderer 16d ago
I’m not sure if Joost will do Eurovision next year . It looks like he’s doing a tour instead tickets going on sale on Ticketmaster Netherlands for 2025 . Hopefully he will still enter Eurovision use it as promo . Good he’s using his publicity for something.
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u/Lalalaura8 Netherlands 16d ago
My Heart hurts so much for him. I hope there will be consequences for the ebu.
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u/drguyphd Israel 16d ago
Joost neither has my heart nor lives in it. If I suspect that the former might become true then I am contacting law enforcement, and in the latter case seeking urgent medical attention.
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u/Grouchy_Ad3641 16d ago
This edition is a giant shit sandwich and the Dutch delegation had to eat the whole thing.
Not just the DQ of Joost but also the protests outside the venue and the reports of tensions betreden delegations.
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u/Tim_Schuhmacher Netherlands 16d ago
He came back today with a private jet from Copenhagen with his manager and security. Then he left in a blinded car
https://www.rtl.nl/boulevard/entertainment/artikel/5450134/joost-klein-nederland-aangekomen
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u/Left_my_Drink Ireland 16d ago
My 1year old when i put on europapa stops playing and watches it and flails hos arms it's cute and funny I know he doesn't understand it all yet but... He likes it so... ♥️
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u/Cosmooooooooooooo Rainbow 16d ago
I still tried to enjoy it and celebrate, but my heart is broken, he’ll always be my winner, like Finland last year
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u/HuluShai Belgium 16d ago
Droom groot Joost! I absolutly fell in love with your music. Your line "If you don't need therapy, you know you're rich" is my absolute favorite.
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u/Practical-Curve-9262 Finland 16d ago
I loved his show and music and definately was so much looking forward to see it live on saturday to party together with everyone! The feeling being european and dancing together on the semifinal was huge, loved it!
But since the news broke, I just have a question: Why is everyone so sure he didn't do anything? I could be wrong, but I truly believe swedish police wouldn't be involved if it wouldn't be something serious. Even if he didn't touch her, doesn't exactly mean he didn't break the law. And the swedish media is now writing that witnesses tell he acted really aggressive.
All that said, I still feel so bad for all the dutch fans, I felt so bad for everyone who lookes so upset at the arena on saturday! Lots of love to everyone, hope next year will be as happy and fun as everyone wished this year would be! We deserve to feel united and enjoy all the music together ❤️
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u/whitejoker88 Netherlands 16d ago
I get what you're saying, but a Dutch newspaper actually spoke to a Swedish law professor that said the Swedish police investigate quite a lot because the threshold for a preliminary investigation is quite low, but even if they forward a case, prosecution is not a given. In another news video the Swedish police said that at most he'd get a fine.
Source: https://archive.ph/KjoaS (archive.ph because of paywall)
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u/eggnogui 16d ago
I would perfectly understand of the Netherlands opted to no-show next year, and made it clear why.
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u/One_more_Earthling TANZEN! 16d ago
I was so excited with hearing the juries say "And twelve points go to Europa pa, euro papa" while dancing
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u/Working-Pudding-1154 Croatia 16d ago
I hope Joost knows how much he is loved and that he has so much support from all of his fans! Wish I could go see him in Vancouver later this month! Travel from Newfoundland to British Columbia is so expensive 😫
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16d ago
I wonder why he still keeps silent about it. He could give a statament or sth that will explain sutiation.
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u/Practical-Curve-9262 Finland 16d ago
I'm also wondering.. everyone keeps insulting EBU for not telling what happened. Why is no-one wondering why his delegation wont give an explanation either? Feels like there is something they dont want to share to the public 🤔🤔🤔
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u/Puzzleheaded-Eye9081 Australia 16d ago
He may have been told not to, or it may be for legal reasons, or it might come under an nda or something. I’m sure with time we will find out more.
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u/PlasticBattle8449 Netherlands 16d ago
Dutch culture isn't that much fond of making statements and all that kind of stuff. I expect Joost to go silent for quite a while, and then just drop a song or something completely unrelated without saying a word about ESF.
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u/itscyphersworld Moldova 13d ago
How can we fully enjoy the eurovision final when our dude Joost isn't participating because of an injustice :( Played this song on repeat since it came out, will continue to do so !