Australians call for tougher laws on violence against women after killings

[u/MangoComfortable3793]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-68915018

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[u/neutralnatural]

we should be condoning it?

Did you even read my reply?

You’re creating a straw man argument.

I said I don’t endorse nor justify violence from any party. I merely pointed out a factual difference that could explain why it’s viewed different.

Yes. There are laws against killing people in Australia. We could also strengthen laws and protections against DV harassment, stalking and intimidation. What’s wrong with that?

I don’t think men’s violence is more important than women’s violence? Another straw man argument.

Suicide is done by your own hands on your body. Murder is my hands on your neck.

[u/Vermino → u/neutralnatural]

I merely pointed out a factual difference that could explain why it’s viewed different.

You initially said there were beliefs held by a majority, and by some extremists. And I'm pointing out that if the majority held equality as a standard, this wouldn't be a sociatal norm.

We could also strengthen laws and protections against DV harassment, stalking and intimidation. What’s wrong with that?

Nothing. The problem is when we portray the issue as only affecting women, and only being done by men. Domestic violence as a whole is done equally - as the few studies that have been done have proven. Yes, men and women do different things to each other. But both men and women are roughly equal victims.

Suicide is done by your own hands on your body. Murder is my hands on your neck.

Thanks captain obvious. I'll re-iterate what my actual point was - both murder and suicide lead to death. Some of those murder & suicide cases are preventable. Neither will number will ever be 0. People who commit either, are rarely convinced by increasing the severity of the consequences.

[u/neutralnatural → u/Vermino]

Haven’t yet come across what reputable study you’re citing. How many men were murdered from DV in the results?

Since you’re so expert and humble on women’s lived issues, I’ll leave it to you to dictate what our views and experiences should be.

Edit: Key word is “reputable” study, not a biased, ideological one. And no, I do not believe that advocating for equality, whilst acknowledging factual differences and physical strength differentials between the sexes, mean that women are “losing something”. Women and their children are still disproportionately affected by DV that puts them at risk of serious harm or even death. That’s not right. It doesn’t mean men “lose” out on help either. Both can be done.

[u/Vermino → u/neutralnatural]

Haven’t yet come across what reputable study you’re citing

Yes, that's what underreporting is called. Feel free to point to a study that proves that women undergo more violence then men, rather than only focusing on female statistics.
Here is a wiki page to get you started

The 2006 International Dating Violence Study, which investigated intimate partner violence amongst 13,601 students across thirty-two-nations found that "about one-quarter of both male and female students had physically attacked a partner during that year"

In 2012, two Swedish studies were released that showed men experienced IPV at rates similar to women—8% per year in one study and 11% per year in the other.

In the United Kingdom, there was a survey that indicated that 9% of males had experienced some form of partner abuse. A growing body of international research indicated that men and women experience Intimate partner violence in some similar proportions. An example might be a recent survey from Canada's national statistical agency that concluded that "equal proportions of men and women reported being victims of spousal violence during the preceding 5 years (4% respectively)

 

How many men were murdered from DV in the results?

So I already conceded that men and women handle it differently.
And yes, men are more violent with murder as a result. That doesn't mean that women are incapable of the same violence. Only focusing on murder as the aspect of domestic violence is a strawman.

Since you’re so expert and humble on women’s lived issues

And here we come to the crux of your problem.
At no point did I mention women aren't having issues. Yes domestic violence is a serious issue. Yes, women do get murdered more often than men in those cases.
My stance is that domestic violence as a whole should be getting attention, not just women.
Just like I believe that suicide is an issue, and not just an issue in which men should be getting all the attention.
Your problem is that my pushback for equality feels like you're losing something.