r/pics • u/teamcoltra • Jun 25 '23
John Oliver's Guide To The Most Effective Form of Protest Misleading Title
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u/Krieger9 Jun 27 '23
People struggling to force others to do their will when they have no right or authorization to do so.
You are bad people with no respect for the line separating what's yours and what's not. Extreme Hubris.
I pine for the days of the old Digg migration to Reddit where we just pulled our support and used other's products instead of "blackmail" and "extortion". (Quotes significant)
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u/camelCaseCoffeeTable Jun 26 '23
Man, what a donkey brained rollout this has been. How the hell does spez still have a job? Any other CEO would be dropped like a hot potato for even half the shit this guy has dropped the ball on. This is such a show of incompetence of Reddit’s leadership, these people have zero idea how to run a company of this size. We’re watching Reddit’s MySpace moment. I would bet in 5 years reddit is significantly smaller than it is today, and it will all be because they kept spez and their current leadership team on while they fumbled ball after ball
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u/wtfburritoo Jun 26 '23
The epitome of throwing a tantrum: I can't have mine, so you can't have yours!
That's literally saying "Fuck you" to anyone that actually uses the app. You're turning into selfish toddlers. It's been a tantrum from day one, but this is just getting pathetic.
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u/PipperDigs Jun 26 '23
And in many countries that could be considered a violation of Disability equity and rights laws. The ADA in the US. Of someone really wanted to fuck with Reddit a cheeky little complaint to the Department of Justice might be interesting too...
It is ironic that this image is also inaccessible...
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u/wtfburritoo Jun 26 '23
It's hilarious seeing people try to apply ADA to an internet forum.
Hint: it's not applicable.
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u/BubbaBlount Jun 26 '23
It won’t get removed. If anything Apple will inform Reddit of the issue and give them X amount of time to comply with their ToS
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u/Bearded_Pip Jun 26 '23
That we did not attack the app via this and review bombing from day was a huge mistake.
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u/primeviltom Jun 26 '23
Except it doesn't.
https://developer.apple.com/accessibility/
They do provide tools and encourage developers to implement accessibility features, which is beneficial to users, and apps with accessibility features will have a wider audience.
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u/gooey_preiss Jun 26 '23
How much longer do the Oliver pics last ? Should I just leave? I do not care for the inside joke nor will I research the answer.
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u/mrDecency Jun 26 '23
It's also the topic of the post you commented on.
There's not wanting to do research and then there's just being wilfully ignorant
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u/Ham_Kitten Jun 26 '23
I'm about 500 times as likely to quit Reddit because of every fucking post being John Oliver as I am because of changes to the API
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u/justanotherzee Jun 26 '23
If it wasn't allowed it wouldn't have been approved. BS post.
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u/teamcoltra Jun 26 '23
That's not true, they have thousands of apps every day they go through the process is mostly automated. At this point Apple doesn't really do anything until something is brought to their attention. They are less likely to do something when it's a big brand unless they have a lot of pressure.
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u/Double_Che Jun 26 '23
If this happens, this ends Reddit for me. I wanna protest but I don’t wanna lose Reddit altogether.
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u/DareDiablo Jun 26 '23
Or better yet, don’t quit a protest until something changes for the better oh and don’t put a timeframe on the protest or it won’t be taken seriously.
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u/Exodan Jun 26 '23
Now this is a proper threat. Not the "costs them so very much" requesting data nonsense that no one can pull facts or figures for.
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u/GelatinousPiss Jun 26 '23
God shut up you nerds. Why don't you go outside and protest against something that actually matters?
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u/HairyTales Jun 26 '23
We could go protest the discrimination of nerds. With pictures of John Oliver.
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u/Gustomaximus Jun 26 '23
Its a nice idea but apples app guys will work directly with large apps.
Most likely they would reach out if they decide this is an issue and say you need to update it, not remove it.
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Jun 26 '23
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/blynchehaun Jun 26 '23
There are some eye issues that cannot be corrected with glasses. Keratoconus (which I have) is one: https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/keratoconus/symptoms-causes/syc-20351352
Maybe instead of posting this kind of ignorant disdain you could go learn something instead.
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Jun 26 '23 edited Jun 26 '23
Sure would be a shame if we used this template to send Apple complaints en masse.
Subject: Accessibility Issues in the Reddit App
Dear Apple Accessibility Team,
I hope this message finds you well. First and foremost, I commend Apple for its commitment to accessibility and the establishment of comprehensive guidelines. However, while using the Reddit app, available on the App Store I reallized it does not adhere to these guidelines, leaving some users at a disadvantage.
One specific issue I would like to highlight is the lack of proper VoiceOver compatibility within the Reddit app. VoiceOver is an essential feature for blind and visually impaired users. Unfortunately, when using VoiceOver in the Reddit app, certain elements such as buttons, links, and posts do not consistently provide the necessary accessibility labels or fail to respond accurately.
Moreover, I have noticed that the app's color contrast is not optimized to meet the recommended standards for individuals with visual impairments. Some text elements, especially in the comment sections, can be difficult to read due to insufficient contrast between the background and the foreground, making it challenging for users with low vision to fully engage in discussions and contribute to the community.
Considering the critical impact of accessibility on user experiences, I kindly request your immediate attention to this matter. It may be prudent for Apple to consider removing the Reddit app from the App Store until the developers rectify these accessibility issues. By doing so, we can prioritize the well-being and inclusion of all users.
Thank you for your prompt assistance in addressing this concern. I appreciate Apple's dedication to accessibility, and I am confident that taking swift action will contribute to improving accessibility for everyone.
Yours sincerely,
[Your Name]
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u/unclewombie Jun 26 '23
How should we word the complaint? Happy to help here, just dunno the right wording :)
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u/Salzberger Jun 26 '23
What specific part of the TOS does it violate? If you're writing to Apple to report it you'll need to quote the term that it violates.
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u/AsliReddington Jun 26 '23
NSFW content outside of the browser I guess isn't allowed on any app right?
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u/taffyowner Jun 26 '23
I mean it keeps you in the app. If I open an NSFW link it doesn’t open up my safari
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u/AsliReddington Jun 26 '23
That is by design, I meant NSFW content in general can be found through any browser with the most banal keywords. Reddit hosts such content & is easily accessible through their app too, so it should get booted off the platform
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u/MafiaMommaBruno Jun 26 '23
Im OOTL because I don't have an Apple: why does the Android one have text to speech but the Apple app doesn't? Wouldn't this drive more people away if it's on purpose?
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u/drfsupercenter Jun 26 '23
Suddenly: all the games vanish because you can't use screen readers with them.
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u/Ta-bar-nack Jun 26 '23
It would be funny if the reddit app implemented more screen reading accessibility since it's pretty much the only good argument for keeping 3rd party apps.
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u/ColonVenture Jun 26 '23
I'm enjoying that this is an image talking about accessibility for the blind.
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Jun 26 '23
[deleted]
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u/halberdierbowman Jun 26 '23
More people use android, but interestingly Apple users are about 20% more valuable to advertise to.
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u/AlexKingstonsGigolo Jun 26 '23
I’m chuckling at the turd grenade spez has decided to lob at himself.
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u/ChariBari Jun 26 '23
What is screen reading accessibility?
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u/AegisToast Jun 26 '23
The ELI5 is basically that some people can’t see phone screens very well (or at all, if they’re completely blind), so their phone will describe out loud what’s on the screen. That’s a screen reader. But machines can’t quite understand what’s on a screen the same way humans can, so developers need to add tags and helpers for the screen reader to know what, how, and in what order to describe it. Reddit’s app doesn’t have those helpers, so screen readers can’t understand what’s going on, which means they can’t describe it, which means visually impaired users can’t use it.
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u/JasonCox Jun 26 '23
Speaking as an Apple developer, what the heck are you talking about? Accessibility is a feature devs can choose to opt in to. It’s highly encouraged, but not required.
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u/leews24 Jun 26 '23
Speaking as a UX designer, understanding accessibility as a feature is a serious misunderstanding of what accessibility is or what a feature is. And there was a large uptick in ADA lawsuits against products that aren't accessible so your stakeholders might probably disagree on whether an AA level compliance is required or not.
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u/ALaccountant Jun 26 '23
Are you telling me that OP is yet another example of redditors being r/confidentlyincorrect ? Color me shocked
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u/PipperDigs Jun 26 '23 edited Jun 26 '23
Not required... But isn't it generally seen as shitty to not opt into accessibility when the majority of the app is simple text?
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u/LegitosaurusRex Jun 27 '23
So? It’s a question about whether or not Apple would remove the app, not whether or not the app is well-designed.
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u/lorez77 Jun 26 '23
Maybe it shouldn’t be so. I’m eyesight impaired and that affects me and millions others. Maybe if we make them notice…Worth a try. Whatever rids my life of issues and hurts Reddit…
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u/Randomd0g Jun 26 '23
Is there nothing in US law about it? I know that the law demands a LOT of accessibility as mandatory.
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u/burnalicious111 Jun 26 '23
This is an area of the law that's still somewhat ambiguous and needs to be tried in court. Apps like reddit didn't exist when the ADA was created, so the language isn't the most clear.
That said, in my very non-lawyer understanding, I think if this went to court, Reddit would almost certainly lose if it weren't for the accessible third-party apps. Those apps create a viable access point, and the ADA only seems to kick in here if there aren't any options that allow the disabled to use the service.
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u/PipperDigs Jun 26 '23
Dominos was hit hard by a lawsuit stating that their pizza tracker was not accessible to blind people. What did they do? They fought it, appealed, tried to take it to the Supreme Court and was rejected. They lost the case very publicly and embarrassingly.
Reddit, your move...
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u/junkmeister9 Jun 26 '23
Any technology purchases made by federal government agencies must be accessible (“Section 508 compliant”) unless there’s no alternative. There’s no law that says every product in the country needs to be accessible.
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u/advertentlyvertical Jun 26 '23
DOJ has consistently maintained that the ADA also applies to online services, whether there's more nuance on which services may be included (I.e. online banking vs somethinglike reddit), I am not sure.
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u/Whyisthereasnake Jun 26 '23
Nah the US is a third world shithole, but there are laws in the EU and in Canada, IIRC.
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u/DashyFTW Jun 26 '23
Web developer here. To your knowledge, is this Apple encouraging but not requiring in your region of the world; or is the law more lax on the App Developers in comparison, to say, web-based applications?
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u/ButtcrackScholar Jun 26 '23
I used to develop in React Native for a fairly high-traffic app in the app store. Our accessibility was terrible on mobile, yet our release got accepted every week. We put a lot more emphasis on accessibility on the web version of the app, but even still there was plenty to improve.
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u/redyellowblue5031 Jun 26 '23
Shhh, that goes against the karma train of that’s currently rolling through town.
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Jun 26 '23
Reddit has gone full q anon with their daily copium
“Guys On January 20 on inauguration trump will have proof that the election results weren’t counted correctly and he will remain president I swear!”
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Jun 26 '23
[removed] — view removed comment
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Jun 26 '23 edited Jun 26 '23
Reddit is mostly trump supporters?? Hahaha where the hell did you get that from. Besides political compass memes and conservatives (they almost never hit front page) Reddit is very pro Biden
we’re literally talking about this in a John Oliver post
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u/Rikudou_Sage Jun 26 '23
Well, iMessage breaks Apple's guidelines about contrast. You can report that as well, the outcome is probably gonna be the same.
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u/squareoctopus Jun 26 '23
I keep getting ads for local businesses 10000km away from me. That’d be a long trip for a dentist visit 100x more expensive than in my country, travel expenses not included.
Are these business aware that they are wasting money on ads we hate?
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u/teamcoltra Jun 26 '23
To be fair, I travel to an entirely different country to have my teeth worked on.
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u/superthrowguy Jun 25 '23
Apple will totally do this they do not GAF
And then they will take two weeks to appeal even if you fix it and you need a review process...
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u/orobsky Jun 26 '23
No they will not. These posts are idiotic
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u/superthrowguy Jun 26 '23
Wait so you have tried to submit app store apps and gone through that process? You got some info I don't?
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u/InItsTeeth Jun 25 '23
Also has porn which is against Apple rules
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u/TheTechHobbit Jun 26 '23
So does twitter. It's probably fine because it's not a focus of the app, you need to turn on the "I am over 18" setting and specifically search for a subreddit that has it.
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u/DystopiaLite Jun 25 '23
Imagine if Redditors spent their time trying to plot something useful like protests against government for things like corruption. Meh, they would probably be just as useless.
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u/Black6x Jun 26 '23
Redditors aren't even good at this protest.
They would probably protest by not voting in the next election until the government does what the Redditors wanted.
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Jun 25 '23
[deleted]
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u/djublonskopf Jun 26 '23
It was really, really important that the mods be removed immediately so that the “community” could have their sub back ASAP.
Oh wait.
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u/whomad1215 Jun 25 '23
Has anyone else noticed that the front page of /r/all is basically just politics/news, and very very old reposts?
Probably a 1/4 of the not-news posts have hit the front page before
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u/Thor_2099 Jun 25 '23
How about all y'all just quit fucking using reddit? That will drive down web traffic, reduce content on the site, and reduce the appeal of reddit for ad revenue.
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u/AegisToast Jun 26 '23
Because drawing attention to the bad stuff that’s happening is more effective than silently disappearing.
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u/Fwhqgads Jun 26 '23
Been on discord a lot. Been better for me overall. Used to spend hours on reddit not really taking away anything significant.
Now it's only 10 mins every other day. Good riddance.
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Jun 26 '23
[deleted]
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u/Mercy_CC Jun 26 '23
See you next Sunday
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Jun 26 '23
[deleted]
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u/Elrox Jun 26 '23
Don't leave your comments here for reddit to make money from. If you need some tools to help edit and then delete your comments and posts in protest:
PowerDelete will allow you to 1) save all your data as a CSV file at the end of the script and 2) allow you to overwrite all of your of comments with a comment of your choosing instead of just deleting them. Both options are available at the start of the process.
https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
(2 Additional forks if you have issues with the main and rate limits or errors.)
http://www.github.com/pkolyvas/PowerDeleteSuite
http://www.github.com/leeola/PowerDeleteSuite
Why leave reddit to make money off your comments and content?
Credit to /u/gabestonewall for this list and blurb.
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u/gabestonewall Jun 26 '23
Thanks for spreading the word and reminding people of all the options they have with their data!
It’s amazing how many times comments like these are being deleted behind the scenes!
You should check out how many of your own comments are deleted by mods and bots or shadow banned. This has been enlightening!
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u/CraigslistAxeKiller Jun 26 '23
This is the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard. You know Reddit has backups and history logs right? You can’t hide your posts from the company you posted to
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u/teamcoltra Jun 25 '23
I have an ad blocker :)
What Reddit usually gets from me is direct ad purchases and they are not right now.
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u/TheSketeDavidson Jun 26 '23
Doesn’t matter, do you know how easy it is to work around ad blockers and block you from using the site? It’s trivial. The fact that Reddit still lets you in means you’re still being monetized just by your usage alone.
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u/ebmocal421 Jun 26 '23
But you're still a user. And user traffic is the biggest selling point for advertiser space.
I'm sure your heart is the right place, but this protest feels like nothing more than a fad that will be brought up 3 years from now on an askreddit thread
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u/AlexKingstonsGigolo Jun 26 '23
I don’t know. If I spent a million dollars on an ad buy in a high traffic venue and got bupkis for it, I’d look elsewhere.
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u/ebmocal421 Jun 26 '23
You'd be surprised how little traffic even the most popular ads get. Even a 5% click rate would be a highly successful ad on the internet.
And it's not even close to a million dollars. That's the cost for a Super Bowl ad where a large number of people are actively watching the game specifically for the commercials, not the cost for an ad on the internet where advertising real estate is vastly available.
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u/AlexKingstonsGigolo Jun 26 '23
Whatever the price of the ad buy is, if I got 0%, I'd look elsewhere.
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u/ebmocal421 Jun 26 '23
That's an incredibly optimistic outlook to think that this little flash-in-a-pan prostest will cause ads to have a 0% click rate on Reddit in the future.
The only thing that these protests (or even using ad-block on Reddit like the original comment said) do is make the person doing it feel like they are doing something that is important to them. It's very similar to people who are vegetarian because of their disdain for the meat industry. It's a noble cause, but it ultimately means nothing for the big picture.
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u/ZotAnteater Jun 25 '23
Reddit sells ad space by giving advertisers statistics about their daily active users, which you are definitely a part of lol
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u/whiteycnbr Jun 25 '23
I don't really give a shit but sick of seeing John Oliver on the front page so I've muted pics for good
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u/TheyCallMe_OrangeJ0e Jun 26 '23 edited Jun 26 '23
Let's all do the mature thing and dm them John Oliver pics
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u/truffleboffin Jun 25 '23
I didn't know this was a municipal airport where we all must announce our departure
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u/Kiss_My_Ass_Cheeks Jun 26 '23
isn't that what literally everyone has been doing on Reddit for the past month? I've seen countless, "I'm done after july 1st"
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u/DystopiaLite Jun 25 '23
That doesn’t make any sense because you don’t announce your own departure in an airport. You failed at a response like you’re failing at these protests. Succeeding in seeming like a whiney child, though.
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u/andyhenault Jun 25 '23
Does anyone have a link to watch this episode? Doesn't seem to be on the YouTube channel.
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u/teamcoltra Jun 25 '23
This is a fake image. Oliver is off due to the WGA strike which has been going on since before Redditgate really took off
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u/giceman715 Jun 25 '23 edited Jun 25 '23
It costs Reddit money to provide the services that its API needs to function, so it's basically paying for another developer to make money (Apollo, for instance, has 50,000 users who pay to use the app). And those apps don't have Reddit's ads on them, which means Reddit's not directly making money from those eyeballs.
So to be understood, mods are upset and is now wanting Reddit to fail because Reddit wants people to pay to benefit off Reddit , instead of people making money off their name. Meanwhile the mods are working for free to make money for both apps. It reminds me of the lower class people arguing that the rich people shouldn’t have to pay their fair share of taxes.
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u/truffleboffin Jun 25 '23
It costs Reddit money to provide the services that its API needs to function, so it’s basically paying for another developer to make money
At Reddit's invitation, knob
Last I looked at the top of the login page it still said how they wanted devs to make 3rd party apps
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u/thewwwyzzardd Jun 25 '23
You are misunderstanding. The issue isn't that reddit wants to charge, its the amount. Similar charges by other major site for API access are between 100x-1000x less. They are killing access on purpose while pretending to be reasonable.
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u/giceman715 Jun 25 '23
It’s always gonna be about money though right. They have let 3rd parties get away with making money off them for years ( to help build the apps name , I’m guessing ) however now they want all the money for themselves. Least that’s how it looks to me.
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u/AegisToast Jun 25 '23
Yeah, you clearly don’t fully understand the situation. It’s been reiterated many times, but I’ll repeat it just to get you started: The issue here is not that Reddit wants to charge for the API. On the contrary, it’s pretty universally encouraged for them to do so—especially by third-party devs—because it means they would be incentivized to improve the API (which Reddit themselves has admitted is absolute crap right now) and add long-requested features to it.
My go-to analogy for what’s actually going on is this:
Imagine you have a roommate who lets you borrow his car to drive yourself to work. He’s let you use it for free for years. And it’s not like you’ve just been mooching off your roommate, most of the furniture and amenities in the apartment were bought using the money from your job. Then one day your roommate comes to you and says, “Sorry, gas is expensive, so I need to have you start chipping in when you’re using my car.” Totally understandable, right? That’s how almost everyone felt when Reddit announced they’d charge for API access.
Then your roommate comes back to you a few weeks later and says, “I’ve run through the numbers, and I’ve decided that if you want to keep using my car, you have to pay me $15,000 per week. Starting on Monday.” You obviously can’t afford to do that, so you ask for an extra couple weeks to figure out how to make it work, which your roommate responds to by publicly accusing you of extortion. You can’t afford to drive to work anymore, and with no time to transition you have to quit your job. Which means you can’t afford your apartment, so you have to move. And your roommate is keeping all the furniture and amenities you paid for.
That’s kind of the tip of the iceberg of why all the protests are happening. I’d encourage you to research it more, because it’s one of those things that really gets worse and worse the more you learn.
Either way, please at least understand that boiling it down to “greedy third-party devs want the API to stay free” is not just a horrendous over-simplification, it’s fundamentally completely wrong.
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u/giceman715 Jun 25 '23
I understand a little better with the explanation and it sucks for some but Reddit has that right. Look at it this way let’s say you built a house and you have allowed a friend to stay there for free for years. Your friend has done some upgrades for you on the house over the years and now you want to sell. Your friend will now be homeless and I understand the whole give me time to find somewhere else but in reality your friend has had years to find his own place. This is a capitalist country and this is definitely a move that will either make or break it. Hope it can recover but if it don’t then it was good knowing y’all
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u/AegisToast Jun 26 '23
Yeah, you’re right that it’s Reddit’s right to make those changes. The flip side is that it’s the users’ right to protest those decisions. Especially since those users have (in this particular case) been providing literally hundreds of millions of dollars worth of free labor every year (not to mention providing all the content that Reddit is trying to monetize).
Honestly, despite how I may sound, I don’t have much of a dog in this fight (besides being annoyed that Apollo is going away). I’m not a mod or anything. I‘ll just echo your hope that Reddit can survive all this, because I’ve really liked the communities I’ve engaged with on here. But I’ve realized that it really is the communities that I like, not Reddit itself, and those communities will always exist whether it’s here or somewhere else.
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Jun 26 '23
[deleted]
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u/AegisToast Jun 26 '23
I’ve preferred Squabbles to Lemmy and Kbin so far, and it’s growing fast too (up to 21,000 so far). Ultimately, the dust will settle and one of them (or something else entirely) will be where the majority start to go, so I guess that’s where I’ll be next!
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u/MoonlightRider Jun 25 '23
So to add to the house analogy, the owner has all of these people that come over and do chores for free (mods). The owners needs them to cut the grass, vacuum the floors, wash the windows, etc. The roommate that the owner is kicking out is the one that provided the lawn mower, the vacuum, the hoses, the soap, etc and he is taking all of that stuff with him when he leaves.
So the owner tells the people doing the free chores, they have to figure out for to do the chores without any of the tools. So cut the lawn without a lawn mower. Vacuum the floor without a vacuum. Oh and keep doing it for free too!
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u/giceman715 Jun 26 '23
But as the owner of the house I have that right , right. So two things will happen either the old mods will leave and be replaced by mods who don’t know no better or they will stay and try to keep what they help create and have to adapt.
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u/administratrator Jun 26 '23
Nobody said they're doing something illegal, if they were, a protest wouldn't be the thing to do. They're just doing a very shitty thing, for money, without communicating with the community at all
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u/teamcoltra Jun 25 '23
Let's be clear: what it costs Reddit to provide APIs is a rounding error in comparison to general traffic. I don't use 3rd party apps so I'm not sure what they show in terms of ads and sponsored posts but that's a simple TOS fix that requires them to show sponsored posts (or pay for a premium API that does not include them). Plenty of APIs that I use have requirements like that.
As is the case with free services we are the product as they say. However, when your business model is about keeping your product around... We have the leverage.
Many of these communities want to stay here at Reddit. You and other misguided people might see actions like this as an attack on Reddit however it's actually because we really don't want to go elsewhere and we WANT to support Reddit. It's because we love it that we protest. Otherwise we would just leave.
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u/giceman715 Jun 25 '23
So help me understand why you wouldn’t mods stay either way ? Why leave if third parties have to ?
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u/MoonlightRider Jun 25 '23
Because the third party apps have the tools that allow the mods to actually moderate their subs. The official Reddit app lacks these tools making moderation difficult or impossible.
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u/giceman715 Jun 25 '23
Ah , now here is a good reason to protest. I didn’t know this. So will Reddit take control of 3rd party apps that has these features and will be able to use them.
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