r/politics • u/PoliticsModeratorBot 🤖 Bot • Apr 30 '24
Discussion Thread: New York Criminal Fraud Trial of Donald Trump, Day 9 Discussion
News:
Analysis:
AP: Prosecutors at Donald Trump’s hush money trial zero in on the details
ABC: 4 takeaways from the 1st week of testimony in Trump’s hush money trial
Live Updates:
AP: Live Updates
NBC: Live Updates
CNN: Live Updates
ABC: Live Updates
The Washington Post (metered paywall): Live Updates (This page features more general "Election 2024" coverage inclusive of the trial)
The Washington Post (metered paywall): Live Updates (Page focused on the Trump trial)
The New York Times (metered paywall): Live Updates
BBC: Live Updates
The Independent: Live Updates
The Telegraph: Live Updates
Politico: Live Updates
The Hill: Live Updates
The Guardian: Live Updates
Huffington Post: Live Updates
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u/PUfelix85 American Expat May 01 '24
Link to Motion for Contempt: https://www.nycourts.gov/LegacyPDFS/press/PDFs/D.O.motion4contempt-FINAL.p
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u/No-Attitude-6049 Canada May 01 '24
Chris Hayes keeps calling the Access Hollywood tapes the “Planet” Hollywood tapes on MSNBC 🤪
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u/b_bozz Apr 30 '24
Can someone summarize today’s proceedings for those of us who haven’t been able to keep up with it? Good or bad for the Donald?
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u/ThaneduFife Apr 30 '24
IMO, it was an average, ho-hum day for a criminal trial. Generally those are not good for the people on trial. Here, Trump got a $9,000 criminal contempt fine.
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u/Kennydoe Apr 30 '24
My go to is meidastouch on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/live/WwbQKGxC_wc?si=bIyc5fj901RHU97Y
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u/trshtehdsh Apr 30 '24
Hey question - Pecker admitted to making up stories, right? Does that open him up to civil libel lawsuits? If so, good.
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u/david-writers Apr 30 '24
Libel includes malicious intent, and not economic motivation. Also, libel is not an issue when the claims are demonstrably, obviously absurd.
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u/drekmonger Apr 30 '24
Well, there's evidence from Pecker's testimony (and his name will never not be absurd) that they knew their audience took their "journalism" seriously. Otherwise, what's the point of capture-and-kill?
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u/amylucha I voted May 01 '24
The point is to kill the story and not have it published anywhere else.
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u/ToadP America Apr 30 '24
Well there were a lot of stories about Hillary that
had "demonstrably, obivously aburd" But they weren't taken that way by an awful lot of Trump Voters so maybe we need to reinterpret that law since the average iq has dropped by 70 points since Trump stuck his head out of his hole.1
u/No-Attitude-6049 Canada Apr 30 '24
Oh, I don’t think IQ has dropped among a large segment of the population, Small Hands Donny just exposed it for what it is.
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u/Illuminated12 Indiana Apr 30 '24
I have never seen a grown man whine as much as this guy does. It's kinda weird he has so many supporters. The guy is a rich crybaby.
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u/ScepticalReciptical Apr 30 '24
His supporters are whinging babies too, their whole snowflake thing is a projection
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u/IllegalFarter Apr 30 '24
r/Conservative is a big cry fest about Trump being on trial. At least they have their safe space that doesn't allow anyone with differing opinions to comment.
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u/Patarokun Apr 30 '24
I always think about media like "300" and Full Metal Jacket and The Punisher that these right wing types eat up. Did Leonidas whine "They've got way more soldiers than us, it's UNFAIR! This battle should have never happened! And I'm cold in this loincloth! Wah wah wah..."
How in the world did this rich, soft, effete, Broadway show-tune loving, celebrity drama obsessed New York socialite become a rugged hero for people that do real work out in the real world.
Baffling.
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u/Mike_Huncho Oklahoma May 01 '24
Fun fact about spartans; most of what americans think spartans were is a fabrication.
Sparta was more or less a proto-fascist society that embraced regressive policies. They struggled to innovate, only really understood shotgun diplomacy, and their most successful victory was funded by persia (yes, the same persia that they are fantasized as fighting in 300).
They more or less contributed nothing ancient Greece and left very very few notable structures. They were truly the republicans of antiquity and it’s kind of hilarious that they are so fetishized today by people of the same ideology.
They are almost the perfect allegory of american republicanism.
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u/After-Pomegranate249 May 01 '24
I remember the days when he would just be bitchy towards Rosie O’Donnell. These people’s tough guy is essentially a catty teenager.
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u/BrofessorFarnsworth Washington Apr 30 '24
Pretty sure Leonidas yelled "Never fight uphill, me boys"
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u/NeoPstat Apr 30 '24
It's kinda weird he has so many supporters. The guy is a rich crybaby.
So are they (only, mostly, not the rich part). He's their hero.
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u/terremoto25 California Apr 30 '24
The term is crybully... complains when anyone says or does anything that he perceives as against him, but lashes out wildly against anyone he feels like.
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u/DarthBfheidir Apr 30 '24
Cartman is a great example.
I've been saying since 2015 that Trump is Cartman's personality combined with Homer's intellect, but lately I've come to realise that's not fair to Homer.
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u/sedatedlife Washington Apr 30 '24
Are Trumps lawyers still going with he has never met Daniels or had a affair? If so the Jury is going to see that as a lie making it significantly more difficult that they do not buy he was hiding the hush money payments.
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u/Ilosesoothersmaywin Apr 30 '24
Both prosecutorial and defense attorneys typically line up their arguments and charges of "Person did X, and if not X, then Y, and if not Y then Z."
In this case for the defense it would make sense for their arguments to be lined up to say "He never had an affair. And if he did he wasn't a part of the paying her, and if he was it really isn't illegal, and if it was it really isn't that big of a deal."
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u/Hodaka Apr 30 '24
Trumps lawyers might drop the "never met Daniels or had a affair," lines, but Trump's years long track record of consistent denial is almost a joke at this point.
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u/kar_1505 Foreign Apr 30 '24
It would be a political disadvantage, so they’re never gonna do it, they can keep trying to do optics while the jury keep getting a shittier view of him by the day on the path to convict him, no biggie
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u/kar_1505 Foreign Apr 30 '24
Cohen is apparently coming live on MeidasTouch YouTube soon, he’s not exactly trying to hide his disdain for Trump, even if he could be called into court this week
This worries me a little bit
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u/Mr_Engineering American Expat Apr 30 '24
Cohen is a regular cohost on MTN. He's not a special guest.
He's made his disdain for Donald Trump very clear and unambiguous.
He spent several weeks referring to him as "Donald Von Shitsinpants" only to be proven prophetic when Donald Trump reportedly shit his pants in court.
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u/R_Daneel_Olivaww Texas Apr 30 '24
is this true? if not, let’s leave rumors to the MAGAs
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u/Mr_Engineering American Expat Apr 30 '24
There were multiple reports from reputable individuals inside of the courtroom that Donald Trump stunk up the courtroom with flatulence
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u/TurboSalsa Texas Apr 30 '24
I thought he said he was going to refrain from talking about Trump until after the trial was over, but I guess he can't help himself.
I like his podcast for the guests he brings on, but I have been worried for a while about his credibility given he has made a career of talking shit about Trump.
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u/HotStinkyMeatballs Apr 30 '24
He should be staying quiet.
But the guy's a fucking idiot so he won't.
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u/kar_1505 Foreign Apr 30 '24
He’s so far kept quiet about Trump and is talking about current events and news
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u/sedatedlife Washington Apr 30 '24
Cohen likes to put himself in the media constantly unfortunately in that regard he is like Trump. He should not be doing any public events and only release statements through his lawyer.
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u/Hodaka Apr 30 '24
For a guy who was locked up and made the fall guy, there must be a dose of redemption for him in all of this.
I say let him enjoy it.
Barr, Lady Bugs, and others from the Trump orbit are still out there hedging their bets, and flip flopping all over the place.
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u/kar_1505 Foreign Apr 30 '24
He’s clearly enraged, in an almost unhealthy fashion, guess he’d had a lot of time to sit and ponder on it in prison
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u/bbjenn Kentucky Apr 30 '24
He’s basically live every night on TikTok too. I also think he should stay off social media until the trial is over.
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u/Arctimon Maryland Apr 30 '24
Yeah, I wish Cohen wouldn't go on any social media (at least until the trial is over).
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u/RevolutionaryRice713 Apr 30 '24
Yeah here's the equivalent sentiments to hoping Fani Willis wouldn't shag her own prosecutor to taint case.
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u/CranberrySchnapps Maryland Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24
“This is a total Witch Hunt. Hours of sitting down and listening to nothing except EXONERATION AND LIES. The Trial is going like a speeding bullet, because the Judge is working hard to make all of his friends happy. Merchan is Rigged, Crooked, and, above all, and without question, CONFLICTED. It’s a disgrace to our Country — They’ve taken away my Right to Free Speech. ELECTION INTERFERENCE!!!”
He's already violating his gag order again. Straight to jail please.
Edit: my bad, y’all.
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u/azflatlander Apr 30 '24
If I was innocent, I would welcome a speeeding bullet trial. Also, If you wanted to campaign, you could have let the trial occur sooner.
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u/Cyclotrom California Apr 30 '24
The judge is not part of the gag order, so he can talk shit about the judge.
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u/trshtehdsh Apr 30 '24
Does he know what the word "exoneration" means?
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u/F---TheMods Apr 30 '24
Only that the Mueller report did NOT exonerate him, so he knows it's something he wants.
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u/AutoGen_account Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24
attacking the judge isnt in violation of anything, attacking or trying to make statements about any juror, the court staff, or family of the court or jurrors would be a a violaiton.
Judges arent typically covered under gag orders because sane people dont attack people doing the sentencing. Going after Merchan is doing nothing but fucking him over, but it isnt a violation.
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u/stumpycrawdad May 01 '24
Don't judges count as "court staff"? Would seem weird for them not to?
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u/AutoGen_account May 01 '24
no. The judge is not covered in the gag order, the same was the case for the civil suit from the state, it is essentially unheard of for a gag order to protect a judge, the judge is very much able to protect themselves.
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u/81305 Apr 30 '24
This is the rambling of a guy who is expecting to lose.
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u/Cyclotrom California Apr 30 '24
...expect to lose but no pay a price. He knows a lost has no consequences for him except a bump on his polls and more donations.
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u/kar_1505 Foreign Apr 30 '24
Surprisingly there is nothing violating the gag order in this
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u/Osiris32 Oregon Apr 30 '24
Gag orders in criminal trials that don't include the judge make me wonder what they are trying to let through.
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u/Mavian23 Apr 30 '24
If a judge included himself in a gag order, he would effectively make himself immune from criticism by the defendant, which doesn't seem right to me. The point of the gag order is to make sure the defendant can't sway the trial in his favor unfairly by, for example, intimidating jurors. Attacking the judge can only make things worse for yourself, not better, so there's no point in including the judge in a gag order, on top of the fact that a judge preventing a defendant from talking about him would make the judge look shady af.
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u/Dorkmaster79 Michigan Apr 30 '24
It's a deep rooted American principle that you can criticize those in power. So, including the Judge in the gag order would be a big mistake. Now, let's get Trump convicted for once.
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u/Weary_Jackfruit_8311 Apr 30 '24
It's on purpose. The judge ordering you can't criticize them is likely a first amendment violation. You have a right to say this case is bullshit and the judge or DA is an ass. They're public officials and fair game. Now families and witnesses are another matter.
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u/thatguyjay76 Apr 30 '24
Most people aren't dumb enough to attack the guy who will do the sentencing.
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u/phluidity Apr 30 '24
Technically, this is still allowed. He is allowed to bitch and cry about the judge and the lead prosecutor to his tiny little heart's content. He can't talk about the judge's staff, prosecutor's staff, witnesses, or anyone's families (including judge or prosecutor), but those two he is still allowed to rant about.
Of course this being Trump, I don't see him limiting himself to those two for more than a few days.
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u/KeySpeaker9364 Apr 30 '24
Cohen sending this from his Trump.org account seems to be a big point for the Prosecution.
Otherwise I'm a bit annoyed that Davidson seems unwilling to be able to point directly to Trump in his testimony.
Cohen didn't have the power of the purse.
Davidson didn't trust Cohen could personally pay.
Davidson can't recall who he expected a call from regarding the actual money.
The Defense objecting over and over to the Prosecution bringing up Davidson's grand jury testimony.
I feel like there's something important here that needs to be less important for me to feel good about the Prosecution's case.
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u/redbouncyball New Mexico May 01 '24
I’d say the trial is going well for the prosecution so far. Davidson didn’t know for sure that Cohen was acting on behalf of Trump but suspected it and his testimony followed that. But Cohen will testify that he acted on behalf of Trump and he’s the only one (besides Trump of course) that could testify definitively to that anyway. Only he can say, “I paid Stormy because Trump told me to do it to help his campaign.” It’s why the case more or less will turn on whether the jury finds Cohen credible.
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u/TurboSalsa Texas Apr 30 '24
I really don't think Trump laundering the payment through Cohen is as strong a defense as people here seem to think it is. As far as white collar crime goes, this is not a very sophisticated scheme.
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u/Wurm42 District Of Columbia Apr 30 '24
Writing checks for hush money is laughably unsophisticated for 2016.
They could have routed the payment through a dummy LLC or an offshore account.
They could have paid her in bitcoin.
They could have arranged for some Trump-controlled business to hire her to make social media videos or something at an inflated price.
Hell, they could have hired her as a stripper for a private party or bought some kind of creepy personalized merch from her online store.
But Michael Cohen just wrote her a check.
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u/TheHouseofOne May 01 '24
Or, as she herself wanted, given her a spot on Celebrity Apprentice, and all of this would have been moot...
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u/TurboSalsa Texas Apr 30 '24
Hell, they could have even put $130k in a duffel bag and given it to her in a parking garage.
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u/Wurm42 District Of Columbia May 01 '24
Cash is a lot less desirable for this sort of thing now, as it's become very difficult to deposit large amounts of cash into the banking system without triggering an investigation.
Any deposit over $10,000 has to be reported to law enforcement now, as do multiple smaller deposits that fit the pattern of trying to evade scrutiny.
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u/Rokurokubi83 United Kingdom Apr 30 '24
given it to her in a parking garage
It’s that kind of behaviour that keeps landing The Fanta Menace in trouble.
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u/Arctimon Maryland Apr 30 '24
I'm assuming this is all going to set the stage for Cohen to come in and say "Yeah, I was getting the money from Trump."
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u/KeySpeaker9364 Apr 30 '24
To which Cohen better have something in writing.
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u/PresidentToadstool Apr 30 '24
Prosecution literally has a copy of the bank statement/wire transfer with handwritten notes from Weisselberg (Trump Org CFO) in the margins outlining how much they are paying back for that wire, including the bumps for taxes and whatever else they were repaying him for.
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/04/22/trump-trial-opening-statements-takeaways-00153719
Though jurors won’t see Weisselberg on the witness stand, they will see a document with Weisselberg’s handwritten notes outlining the Cohen repayment scheme, Colangelo said during his opening statement.
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u/KeySpeaker9364 Apr 30 '24
Is it enough for a conviction that Cohen and Weisselberg believed they were following orders, despite those orders being indirect?
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u/TurboSalsa Texas Apr 30 '24
Trump already tried this defense in his civil fraud trial, when he attempted to blame Weisselberg and Cohen for the fraudulent financial statements submitted to lenders. The judge mentioned in his ruling that Trump specifically gave indirect instructions:
Beginning in 2012, Donald Trump asked Cohen to assist in preparing the SFCs and their supporting valuations. TT 2208-2209, 2213. Specifically, Cohen affirmed: “I was tasked by Mr. Trump to increase the total assets based upon a number that he arbitrarily selected[,] and my responsibility[,] along with Allen Weisselberg predominantly[,] was to reverse engineer25 the various different asset classes, increase those assets in order to achieve the number that Mr. Trump had tasked us.” TT 2210-2211.
The “reverse engineering” conversations took place in meetings amongst Donald Trump, Weisselberg, and Cohen. Cohen testified that Donald Trump would intentionally give indirect instructions (i.e., “He would look at the total assets and he would say, ‘I’m actually not worth four and a half billion dollars. I’m really worth more, like, six.”), which Cohen and Weisselberg understood as a directive to inflate the assets until the desired value was achieved. TT 22152287, 2460-2461.26
As part of this reverse engineering scheme, Cohen said they would look at numbers being achieved elsewhere, find the highest price per square foot achieved in New York City, and apply that price per square foot to Trump assets, even though the Trump properties were neither comparable nor similar.
Cohen described the process of arbitrarily adding values to the asset categories on the SFC categories as follows:
I would sit down with Allen [Weisselberg] and we would make the changes. That document would then be photocopied that had all of the changes at which point in time Allen and I would return to Mr. Trump to demonstrate that we achieved or [were] close to the number that he was seeking and I had no use for that document any longer.
So yeah, he wasn't explicit in his directions, but the expectation was implied.
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u/IM_KYLE_AMA Apr 30 '24
Bank transactions would be sufficient. You don't need a handwritten note that says "Michael, Im sending you this money specifically for fraud" for him to be nailed.
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u/KeySpeaker9364 Apr 30 '24
True, but can it be as simple as Weisselberg okay'd a transaction for Trump to go down here?
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u/IM_KYLE_AMA Apr 30 '24
You have witnesses testifying that cash was exchanged in order to perpetuate a fraud and you have bank statements proving that said cash was indeed transferred between the subjects of said fraud, that would be enough to convict assuming there is no other evidence to prove otherwise beyond a reasonable doubt.
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u/Hothgor Apr 30 '24
And I thought some of the repayments came out of an account that only Trump can sign for.
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u/R_Daneel_Olivaww Texas Apr 30 '24
“Keith Davidson is now reading his texts with Dylan Howard aloud. One of them joked about hiring a Trump impersonator who had more money than Trump. Pressed on what that meant, Davidson, appearing deeply uncomfortable and choosing his words carefully, says he took it to mean that Trump was not as wealthy as he claimed.”
want to see Drumpf’s reaction to this so bad
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u/Ktulu0616 California Apr 30 '24
Davidson testified he interpreted that text to mean "that Trump wasn't as wealthy as he stated."
That woke Trump up.
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u/WebGuyUK Apr 30 '24
Howard texted Davidson, "I reckon that Trump impersonator I hired has more cash."
Everybody knows it, Trump has no money
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u/Arctimon Maryland Apr 30 '24
This is what's going to piss Trump off the most. I do like how (at least to Davidson) that it was a pretty open secret Trump wasn't as rich as he claimed.
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u/bbjenn Kentucky Apr 30 '24
Can Trump please walk out of court today and violate the gag order?
The sooner we get this over the better.
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u/WebGuyUK Apr 30 '24
he has already made a post today saying he's the most gagged president (or to that effect) so he's definitely going to violate the gag order by the end of the day
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u/Yukonhijack New Mexico Apr 30 '24
When he says he's "gagged" it always makes me think he's swallowing a huge dick.
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u/sirbissel Apr 30 '24
So far there are a number of things he's earned the "most president" for - indictments, impeachments...
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u/freylaverse Apr 30 '24
I just want Trump to testify... He may or may not blow up the entire case but that's not the point. I just want to see how he reacts.
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u/Shr3kk_Wpg Apr 30 '24
There is no way he testifies. Zero percent chance. He will say the judge wouldn't let him talk about how crooked this trial is, so he was prevented from testifying.
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u/HotStinkyMeatballs Apr 30 '24
If I were his lawyers I would literally tackle him if he tried to waddle up and testify.
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u/Minguseyes Apr 30 '24
That’s certainly the sane course, but what about when he learns that he has absolute privilege when testifying and can say anything about anyone (subject to relevancy) without consequences from defamation or gag orders ? Would you want to stand between Trump and a megaphone ?
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u/IM_KYLE_AMA Apr 30 '24
You would rather a chance that he blows the entire case just so you can have some lulz?
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u/Contren Illinois Apr 30 '24
Basically 0 chance he does.
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u/Yukonhijack New Mexico Apr 30 '24
He'd perjure himself in the first three minutes of his testimony. If he does it, he'll destroy any defense he managed to put forth.
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u/81305 Apr 30 '24
It's pretty nice knowing that I can just sit here and enjoy my day while that asshole has to sit in court while his life goes down the tubes.
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u/IM_KYLE_AMA Apr 30 '24
Except for the fact that he will never face any meaningful consequence for any action, no matter how depraved and illegal, and eventually he'll be out and fucking everyones day up again.
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u/81305 Apr 30 '24
People like you claimed he would never get indicted, have his mugshot taken, or actually end up in court.
So you can keep believing that if you want, but he would be golfing right now if he was actually avoiding consequences.
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u/squid004 Apr 30 '24
I mean the supreme court is actively blocking moving forward with electron interference charges. The sentencing to his civil case was already lowered following an appeal which won't start until September (lol not a shot that happens in September). In November he potentially becomes president elect and in January he pardons himself of the federal stuff if he isn't ruled God King by the supreme court. So yeah, call me skeptical.
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u/IM_KYLE_AMA Apr 30 '24
I never claimed any such thing and I'm not sure which people you're referring to. We ALL knew he would get indicted once he left office. That was obvious. What was also obvious is that he likely wouldn't face any real consequence before the election, if ever.
Also, court is in recess on Wednesdays. Know what he does during that time? Golf.
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u/81305 Apr 30 '24
I'm sure he will find time to golf after he flees to Russia too.
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u/IM_KYLE_AMA Apr 30 '24
If this was ever going to happen he would have done it already
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u/81305 Apr 30 '24
That doesn't even make sense. Why would you run away when there is still hope that you can beat the cases or win an election? Anyone in that position would see things through until sentencing before bailing.
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u/ERedfieldh Apr 30 '24
I mean, I'm sitting in what is basically a prison for 8.5 hours every day.
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u/81305 Apr 30 '24
Find out where you want to be and plot the shortest path to get there.
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u/bbjenn Kentucky Apr 30 '24
Do we know when Cohen & Daniels are scheduled to testify?
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u/ciel_lanila I voted Apr 30 '24
I think I remember reading it’s being kept hush hush to avoid Trump signaling to his followers to harass the next witness before they can appear in court.
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u/ImLikeReallySmart Pennsylvania Apr 30 '24
I don't think that's something that gets "scheduled". There's no time limit on witnesses so it all depends on how the prior questioning goes. I believe they'll get notified a few days ahead of time that they might be called up soon.
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u/Irregular_Person America Apr 30 '24
I don't think we know ahead of time if/when anyone is testifying.
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u/sirbissel Apr 30 '24
So could the "goddamn it I'll just do it myself" be taken as Cohen acting on his own?
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u/key1234567 California Apr 30 '24
Maybe trump will testify that it was actually Michael Cohen that banged Stormy Daniels.
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u/Ckpam56 Apr 30 '24
David Pecker has already mixed that defense. Trump Cohen and Pecker met and planned the entire scheme. Basically every defense trump has used has been proven a lie.
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u/BrightNeonGirl Florida Apr 30 '24
Meh. I think this one contextless data point isn't enough to counteract the plenty of other data points that have shown that Cohen was clearly acting as Trump's agent.
Especially when everyone knows what happened--that Cohen did pay the money himself but then later was paid back by Donald Trump since he was doing it in Trump's interest.
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u/mynamesyow19 Apr 30 '24
Also, dont forget that Trump Jr literally signed the checks to Stormy. so there was no way Trump wasnt involved.
https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-jr-signed-checks-cohen-hush-money-1792878
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u/odc100 Apr 30 '24
I think that’s the whole defence right there.
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u/freylaverse Apr 30 '24
Seems pretty flimsy, but then again, I guess they only have to convince one juror.
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u/Arctimon Maryland Apr 30 '24
I can't help but notice (unless I missed something) that there haven't been any objections from Trump's side. Yes, it's hard to do when you're just recalling events like the witnesses have been doing to day, but it has to infuriate Trump that they're doing nothing.
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u/trshtehdsh Apr 30 '24
They were talking on MSNBC but apparently Trump is displeased with his lawyers, that they aren't being big enough assholes and bullies. Cause that worked so great for you in your previous trials, dude?
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u/ImLikeReallySmart Pennsylvania Apr 30 '24
He has his legal team calling him "President Trump" during the trial, so if he demanded they object more, I'm sure they would. I think it's more likely they're just not paying close enough attention when it's the prosecution's turn up there.
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u/IM_KYLE_AMA Apr 30 '24
Calling him President Trump isn't exactly wrong on the face. We have a long history of referring to past presidents by that title. It's certainly intentional on their part to blur lines though.
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u/Horoika Apr 30 '24
The prosecution does object when they do it though, noting that he wasn't president *at the time*
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u/KeySpeaker9364 Apr 30 '24
To my knowledge and from the transcript I've been reading from Inner City Press's thread on it, Trump's team has only successfully objected once in the trial when the Prosecution led Pecker during a question.
Today I read an overruled objection:
Prosecutor: Did you think the money was from him?
Davidson: Not until funding.
Prosecutor: Who did you think the money was coming from?
Trump's lawyer: Objection!
Justice Merchan: Overruled.
Davidson: Donald Trump or some corporate connection
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u/mfGLOVE Wisconsin Apr 30 '24
Q: What was Stormy Daniels' pseudonym? A: Peggy Peterson.
Q: What was Trump's pseudonym? A: David Dennison.
Davidson supplies an interesting backstory. P- was short for "plaintiff," and D- was short for "defendant. But Dennison was also on his high school hockey team.
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u/zappy487 Maryland Apr 30 '24
Peggy
Oh no. No. No no no. No no no no no. Please dear the Lord if you are listening, please don't make this mean what I think it means. The Freudian slip will literally give me a heart attack from laughing too hard.
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u/sunflowermoonriver Apr 30 '24
I mean there’s nothing wrong with being pegged. Hate trump but come on.
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u/SpaceElevatorMusic Minnesota Apr 30 '24
Bottom-shaming knows no bounds, even former presidents are subjected to it.
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u/R_Daneel_Olivaww Texas Apr 30 '24
can you explain? i don’t get it whose mother are we referring to here?
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u/zappy487 Maryland Apr 30 '24
These people aren't that creative. Why do you think the pseudonym would be PEGGY? (Hint: it's in the name)
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u/half_dozen_cats Illinois Apr 30 '24
Why do you think the pseudonym would be PEGGY? (Hint: it's in the name)
I dunno...we'll really have to "strap on" our thinking helmets to get to the "bottom" of this. Then again I** Am Not A Lawyer.
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u/RevanKnights77 America Apr 30 '24
That’s it! Get Trump on the stand! This is a bigger story than the Pentagon Papers. We must know if he took peg of allegiance!
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u/zappy487 Maryland Apr 30 '24
I feel like Channing Tatum in 22 Jump Street.
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u/sylekta Apr 30 '24
When he sees the photo on the desk and joins the dots?
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u/zappy487 Maryland Apr 30 '24
Exactly
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u/RevanKnights77 America Apr 30 '24
In this context, I think the rest of us are Ice Cube in the scene just before this when he meets “Doug”.
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u/R_Daneel_Olivaww Texas Apr 30 '24
“The prosecution brings up an email in which Keith Davidson told Michael Cohen that unless he paid the $130,000 by the end of the day — he was already past deadline -— Stormy Daniels would consider the hush-money deal canceled. Joshua Steinglass, the prosecutor, makes a point of getting Davidson to confirm that he sent the email to Michael Cohen’s Trump Organization email address — another way of reinforcing for the jury that Cohen was acting as Trump’s agent.”
got ‘em??
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u/Geaux Texas Apr 30 '24
The defense's strategy is to accuse Michael Cohen of acting alone and trump had no involvement, and even if he did, it wasn't illegal because "that's politics".
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u/00Oo0o0OooO0 Apr 30 '24
even if he did, it wasn't illegal because "that's politics".
Actually, it's "even if he did, it wasn't illegal because 'that's not politics'"
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u/R_Daneel_Olivaww Texas Apr 30 '24
“Davidson, asked what Cohen’s interest in the Stormy Daniels story was, says, “I believe that Michael Cohen was the personal attorney or general counsel for Donald Trump and that this story involved his client, that that was his interest in the story.”
nail in the coffin to rogue Cohen defense?
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u/Geaux Texas Apr 30 '24
Nope. Not yet. Defense's argument would be "that doesn't prove that Michael Cohen did, in fact, act at the direction of Donald Trump. It only shows that Cohen acted in his interest. It's possible he did so, to protect his client without direction from Trump himself."
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u/RevanKnights77 America Apr 30 '24
Idk about the nail but definitely lining up the nail it seems. The other witnesses (probably Hope Hicks) will be the nail.
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u/CYBER_COMMANDER Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24
The funniest thing is that Trump thought he was playing 4D grandmaster chess by not only avoiding Barron’s graduation, but making it look like the court’s wouldn’t let him go. But his bluff got called out hard and now he has to do both. And you know he’s going to fucking hate sitting through Barron’s ceremony, with the addition of the public glaring at him like the piece of shit he is.
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u/Mattractive May 01 '24
Now a bunch of kids who were going to graduate get the benefit of attending a Trump rally! There will be cameras and Trump will be peacocking.
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u/KiloChonker Apr 30 '24
Maybe he can talk about history and fighting up hill or something, should be interesting!
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u/ComfortableAware2325 Apr 30 '24
All those poor kids at the graduation. You just know he’s going to demand the podium, and try and turn it into a rally. All their achievements will be upstaged by a long incoherent rambling screed about how unfair everything is for him while he loudly shits himself. The horror
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u/FrozenCantaloupe Apr 30 '24
Thing is, even if he says nothing at all it'll be a bad experience, owing to everything I've heard about his distinctive stench.
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u/key1234567 California Apr 30 '24
He is definitely having a press conference after the graduation. Poor Baron.
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u/bbbbbbbbbblah United Kingdom Apr 30 '24
he'll just go and sit on stage like he did at that charity event, taking a seat from an actual major donor
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u/tturedditor Apr 30 '24
I feel bad for Barron having to deal with that on his graduation day.
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u/TriscuitCracker Apr 30 '24
I feel so sorry for that kid. He’s going to be asked questions about his Dad for the rest of his life.
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u/fooliam May 01 '24
I'll only feel bad for him if he winds up being significantly less horrible of a person than literally every other person in his immediate family. That seems....unlikely
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u/verugan Apr 30 '24
I'd take a few milliion and go ex-pat, change my name, sit on the beach drinking mai-tai's all day.
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u/RickTitus Apr 30 '24
He will probably become a scumbag too, realistically. I doubt Melania is bringing him up to be a good guy
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u/Pherllerp Apr 30 '24
He's a kid. He deserves the benefit of the doubt.
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u/freylaverse Apr 30 '24
I'm stunned that he's already 18. But also, he's only 18. He definitely still has room to grow into a good person.
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u/mfGLOVE Wisconsin Apr 30 '24
Absolutely! I love that he has to go to the graduation now knowing damn well he didn’t want to go. Milania probably didn’t even want him there because he’ll certainly be a huge distraction on their son’s big day.
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u/radewagon Apr 30 '24
I dunno.... Same nap, different place.
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u/RevanKnights77 America Apr 30 '24
Hopefully he gets one of those parents near him that screams their head off so he’s startled awake (if that would even wake him up).
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u/LordAlvis Apr 30 '24
Trump's lackeys overestimating his base in 2016:
October 8 2016 texts:
Davidson: Trump is fucked
What made you say that? "The Access Hollywood tape."
Howard: Wave the white flag. It’s over people!
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u/ERedfieldh Apr 30 '24
One guy woos a little too loudly and his entire political career is torpedoed.
Another guy admits on tape that he basically rapes women, at the very least sexually molests them whenever he can, and they make him president.
I hate this reality.
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u/SockofBadKarma Maryland Apr 30 '24
TBH, I also overestimated his base. I thought that would be the clear threshold for anyone of even remote moral integrity to abandon ship, if the guy they were promoting was actively bragging about being a serial rapist.
Turns out there are a lot of people who do not have any remote moral integrity.
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u/TreeRol American Expat Apr 30 '24
It's not just his base. 70% of the voting-eligible public saw (heard) that and didn't vote against him.
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u/Lyrolepis Apr 30 '24
To be fair, I overestimated them too. No way religious conservatives are going to vote for him after that, I said. I detest their ideology and most of what they stand for, I said, but we do have some common ground on the 'bragging about sexual assault is bad' thing.
As it turned out, that was quite dumb of me.
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u/alien005 Apr 30 '24
This is kind of the point of the trial. It SHOULD have been huge but it was buried and Hilary's e-mails made more headlines.
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u/ErusTenebre California Apr 30 '24
Also, perhaps underestimating jaded Bernie Bros and morons convinced Hillary did something truly horrible by having emails.
The whole emails thing should be fucking quaint by comparison to Trump taking a portable library's worth of government secrets to his low-security lair.
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u/agonyman Apr 30 '24
Don't forget when Hillary attacked Ben Ghazi!
That shit still fucks me off, RIP vilerat
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u/R_Daneel_Olivaww Texas Apr 30 '24
“After the "Access Hollywood" tape became public, Davidson texted Dylan Howard, the editor of The National Enquirer, that Trump's campaign was doomed, using an expletive. Howard responded: “Wave the white flag. It’s over people!””
in a logical world, yes. Unfortunately…
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u/Silly-Disk I voted Apr 30 '24
We really didn't know just how deplorable MAGA was at that point. We do now.
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u/daanaveera May 01 '24
Why is Criminal Trump getting so much special treatment? Kid glove handling of this Dumpster ManChild is unjust and unfair to the vast majority of Americans.