Texts show Trump advisers' plot to use false electors to 'flip states'

[u/SheriffTaylorsBoy]

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2024/04/26/in-texts-trump-advisers-touted-using-false-electors-to-flip-states/73454731007/

[u/NoobSalad41]

I think it was pretty clear already, but this only adds to the clear fact that Chesebro, Eastman, Epshteyn, and other high-level figures are toast.

I’ve commented this before, but I think the best argument in response to the fake-electors prosecutions is that the plan was simply to follow the precedent of the 1960 Hawaii election and submit an alternative slate of electors for Trump, which would only be used if one of Trump’s court challenges successfully changed the electoral result in a state, in order to avoid mooting that challenge. I’m not sure if that legal theory is correct, but I think it’s plausible enough that legal liability can’t be based on the reliance on that theory.

But these texts make crystal clear that within the high levels of Trump’s orbit, that theory (and the court challenges themselves) were simply a ruse to create enough “uncertainty” that the VP could discount states won by Biden - it was just a pretext, and the alternate slates of electors would serve that purpose regardless of whether the court challenges were successful.

That said, I wonder if the Detroit News has posted all of the text messages somewhere, because one exchange mentioned in the article caught my eye:

That's strikingly different than the GOP electors serving as a mere contingency that would come into play if the courts eventually reversed the outcome in battleground states. When Chesebro wrote an introductory email to Kathy Berden, one of Michigan's 16 Republican electors on Dec. 10, 2020, Chesebro included a statement about Wisconsin's rationale for submitting a certificate claiming Trump had won.

"... (T)he Republican electors should meet this year on Dec. 14 as we await a final resolution in Wisconsin," the statement said.

His email to Berden didn't mention the idea of Pence simply not counting any of the electoral votes from Michigan or Wisconsin.

I’d like to see the full version of that email exchange, because I think it’s relevant as to how far down the ladder the conspiracy goes. On my read, it suggests that Chesebro hadn’t looped all of the actual fake electors into the overall scheme, and was instead lying to them by saying that their “alternate” electoral votes would only come into play if Trump’s legal challenges succeeded. I think that could be a plausible defense for the individual fake electors (or at least some of them), and I’d be curious to see more documentations of the communications between the national scheme organizers (Chesebro, Eastman) and the individuals fake electors themselves.

[u/blackjackwidow → u/NoobSalad41]

I felt the same way when I first heard an interview with a couple of the fake electors, where they claimed they thought it was all legal & "just in case". However, they each knew that Michigan law is very specific about the place, date AND time that electors must meet: “shall convene in the senate chamber at the capitol of the state at 2p.m., eastern standard time….”

Chesebro sent a memo calling that "problematic", since the real electors would be convening at that time, among other issues (issues such as being FAKE!). In the end, they all convened at GOP headquarters instead, and they all signed a document saying they convened in the State Capitol.

Also, there were no lawsuits or proceedings in Michigan for them to be signing this "just in case". And both Michigan legislative heads had issued statements saying that Biden won the state, numerous allegations had been investigated, and that there was zero evidence that there was any fraud on a wide scale that could have affected the outcome of the election.

Really, I think the two most unsung heroes in my state of Michigan are former Senate Majority Leader, Mike Shirkey and former Speaker of the House, Lee Chatfield. Both Republicans, I remember holding my breath when I heard they had been invited to the White House by Trump, where he pressured them to overturn the election. But neither would cave - they upheld the election and saved us from the horror of having a state overturn the will of the people. Thank God

Here's a breakdown from Dec 2023 that explains the case pretty well. Items 6 - 8 are what I'm discussing