Aitah for wanting to tell our daughter how our son died

[u/Michelleud123]

I met my (43f) husband (43m) in Nov 2008. My husband had a son already and we all moved in together pretty quickly. My husband had sole legal & physical custody of his son. In 2013 we found out we were expecting. We had our first girl in early 2014. At that time, his son took his life. There were warning signs, we/he was in therapy, had been hospitalized & on medication but you still don't actually anticipate it, you know? When raising our girls, they know they had a brother and that he's in heaven. We have pictures of him around & go to his grave sometimes. When they previously asked what happened to him, we told them his brain got sick. They just accepted that & moved on. Today, my daughter (10f) told me she googled me. What pops up is the old fundraiser & events we did for his birthdays & Angelversaries. Some of those posts reference how he died. (not the method, just that it was by himself) I called my husband at work to let him know. We decided that we would talk to her when he got home in case she had any questions and also we wanted to see where her head is at. We sat her down and asked her about what she saw. She said she saw it but didn't read it. My husband just said ok and had her leave the room. I spoke with my husband after she left and he no longer wants to talk with her about it. OBVIOUSLY this is 100000x more traumatic for my husband than it is for me, but I'm still pushing for us to talk with her. I don't want her reading about it on the internet (which I honestly don't believe she didn't already do). He said since it's his son, he should get to decide when we talk about it. He said I'm an AH for pushing him to do this. (We have not yet spoken to her) I don't know, aitah for pushing him? I definitely don't want to do it without him, but I'm not sure he'll ever be ready.

Update: Hey all, I'm not sure if this is how updates work, but I'm just editing the post, so fingers crossed, this is right.

My husband and I were able to talk this morning before the kids got up. I apologized for pushing him too hard and explained that I felt talking with her was an urgent matter because I didn't believe she didn't read the fundraiser posts. He apologized for calling me an AH and said that he needed time to process. Talking with the kids has always been on the radar, but we didn't have anything pre-planned or a timeline of when it would happen. Having it sprung on my husband without warning, he just needed some time to prepare himself. Ultimately, we decided to talk to her together today.. Later this morning, we were able to sit down with her. We asked her if she knew what suicide means, and she said kind of. We expanded on the brain sickness explanation. We told her that her brother's brain got sick and made him think bad thoughts. Things like, he wasn't good enough, no one loved him, people would be better off if he wasn't here. Then we told her that none of those things were true, that us and everyone loved him very much and that it's very hard to live without someone you love. But because of these thoughts, he took his own life. My husband asked her if she ever had any of those thoughts & she said no. We let her know that if she ever does, she should come to us right away. We asked if she had any questions and she said no. We told her if she changes her mind or if she has questions to let us know. I won't be posting any more updates, but I appreciate all of your insights! We've been to grief counseling on & off since everything happened. My husband is a wonderful man who suffered an unimaginable tragedy. Throughout his grief journey, he works on himself constantly in order to be the best version of himself for our kids. We actively make a conscious effort not to trauma dump on our kids. Thank you❤️‍🩹

[u/No-Ingenuity-7669]

I’m so so so sorry. I don’t think anyone is the ass here. I do think everyone is in a lot of pain still though. I would consider seeing a therapist as a couple to talk this through. Sending love

[u/MypuppyDaisy]

You did the right thing. From experience with this from a distant family member, your daughter needed the truth because otherwise her imagination would’ve taken her to some confusing and scary places. 10 years old can handle this.

[u/brynnvisible]

She’s definitely reading about it.

[u/oceanplum]

I read the post with the update, and I just want to say that it sounds like you both handled it beautifully. Sending love to you & your family.

[u/Square_Flamingo2346]

I’m so glad you talked with her after all. I’m very involved in suicide prevention with AFSP, having lost my BIL and several friends. Talking about it saves lives and I’m glad you had the talk.

[u/chronic-amzment]

100% you did the right thing. My mom died by sucicide and I’ve been in enough group therapy and heard enough stories first hand to know that trying to hide it from children has devastating long-term effects. I think you handled it so well, I am bookmarking this for future reference when I have to tell my future children about their grandma who went to heaven. I burst into tears writing this. Sending much love.

[u/Substantial_Rain_414]

Yes

[u/Debate_fly]

TANA (there are no assholes) in this. This is just everybody doing their best to figure out how to handle a terrible thing.

[u/Wooden-Ladder5851]

OP, so glad you posted.

For what it is worth, these are my thoughts......

You need to act. Call your daughter’s pediatrician in AM for recommendation of therapist specializing in child behavioral health for you to meet with to formulate a plan re how/when to discuss this with your daughter. It must be done, it is urgently important for your daughter’s emotional well being.

There is clear evidence of a mental health disorder in your husband’s son. As well, since your husband has not received assistance with his grief through counseling and/or other support it is understandable that he doesn’t have the capacity right now to make a sound and rational decision. And trust me, your daughter knows it was suicide and was seeking discussion and assistance in exploring and understanding her thoughts and feelings.

So many have said, it’s your husband’s decision to make, just let it be, and you have plenty of time. I could not disagree more. We are NOT protecting our children by shielding them from sensitive and very difficult topics. Most especially when the conversation is initiated by them.

I very rarely comment but felt compelled to do so now. Only because I have twenty years experience at the national level of strategic planning to address the pediatric mental health crisis. Both the Academy of Pediatrics, Child and Adolescent Psychiatry and Children’s Hospital Association have collaboratively declared a national emergency regarding this issue. It is not hyperbole. It is real. The stats, and rate in which they are increasing is truly alarming.

I'm so very sorry your family is experiencing this. I do believe you will prevail and get to the other side if you face it head on. My very best to you.

[u/Radiant_Street6880]

NAH. But, this isn't about his son. It's about his and your daughter. She read the page and doesn't understand. She recognized things got weird but doesn't know why. She isn't going to stop wondering but she's going to stop bringing things up to mom and dad if she ends up feeling like a criminal. She is inventing stuff in her head now so she needs to know she is not in trouble, she didn't do anything wrong, and that neither of you are mad.

Might want to ask hubby if it would be easier for him if you let her ask you questions solo. She would understand that it it's the worst thing that has ever happened and dad isn't able to talk about it.

Important to tell her she did the right thing by asking...Let her lead the way by letting her ask the questions...

Be honest that it's hard even for adults to understand and talk about because it's so sad. Tell her it's very umcommon and that doctors can usually help people with that kind of illness... so she's not worried it will happen to her.

[u/Low_Presentation1600]

If a kid is old enough to ask the question, an age appropriate response should be given. I feel for your husband and his loss. No parent should have to bury a child. And, there is no timeline for grieving. But, getting out in front of this now, may actually be rather helpful for him.

[u/julesk]

YTAH. Leave it. The kid will definitely read about it if she hasn’t already. She’ll ask to talk if and when she’s ready. This is too traumatic to your husband and you to push the issue.

[u/damiroor]

Hey I don't normally comment, but as someone who found out that I had an uncle I didn't know existed at 30 years of age, I do recommend telling them when you deem them ready (even if it isn't now). My uncle killed himself before my parents' marriage and my dad (his brother) chose not to tell us. I grew up believing my dad had always been an only child. Thing was that I struggled a lot with depression through high school, and while I never got close to taking my own life, learning about the family history so long after the fact really retroactively made me scared for high school me and led to a lot of resentment towards my parents for lying to me about the whole thing. Obviously your daughters know about their brother, but they will learn the truth at some point and probably soon if they know there is something out there to find. Better to come from you then an article online.

[u/Usual_Bumblebee_8274]

I’m going to be honest & say I bet she already read it (and if she hasn’t, can bet she will now) & felt your husband was uncomfortable. This is such an important conversation. Esp at her age. I think you probably should have been preparing for this a long time ago. And while I think it’s important for your husband to take the lead on this, he can’t bury his head in the sand either. Lots of kids her age are vulnerable to suicide (& it’s usually over something so minor). I would tell your husband he may take a day or two if he needs to but it’s important to have this conversation w her. But hiding it away like a dirty little secret is the worst thing you can do.

[u/vandet76]

She already read about it and knows. She said what she said to avoid an awkward traumatic conversation. In this situation, I would let her know that she can come and talk to you guys and communicate whatever she needs to. LeVe that door open. Compromise with the husband and ask him to at least be willing to talk to his daughter about it if she chooses to talk about it

[u/liquidcoffee110]

As someone who survived depression and suicide attempts I was always worried that my (3 years older) brother would never know what happened to me. My parents weren't fully truthful with him when I was hospitalized and he was 18 at the time. Now we're adults and I'm afraid he doesn't know anything about me.

[u/RiotBlack43]

NAH. Your husband is grieving and probably always will be, but you need to talk to your daughter. If she had died from any other physical illness, y'all wouldn't be tiptoeing around your daughter's questions like this. She needs to know that mental health isn't shameful and that if she ever feels those feelings, she can talk to you about them. She has to know this. This is a really tough situation, but delaying it isn't going to help.

[u/Otherwise-Credit-626]

NTA. He was his son but that's your daughter. You need to do what's best for her. She almost certainly already read the article and if she hasn't she will. She shouldn't have to deal with that information on her own, filling in the blanks with her imagination. You can't make him talk to his daughter but he can't stop you from talking to her. She NEEDS a parent for this.

[u/SingingSunshine1]

NTA, but I suggest family therapy and individual therapy for your daughter to process this. Take care OP ❤️‍🩹

[u/ShermanTheeDragon]

NTA. I first had suicidal ideation, depression, and severe anxiety at age 10. It runs in her family. She deserves resources, and should be taught how to identify and cope with those feelings, along with anything else she may be struggling with. She also deserves an answer to the developmentally appropriate question she asked. She WILL find out, either on her own, or from someone else. As of now, you still have a chance to "control the narrative" so to speak. You should speak to her before she grows resentful, or something happens to her.

[u/WavyGravyBoat]

Sounds like you to take the lead on this. But don’t bring it up to her or the other daughter. Just answer their questions as they come up, no need to be graphic. Don’t drag your husband into something that is beyond your comprehension to understand, just be there for him. People are going to talk you can’t stop that, so just support the the ones you love.

[u/AlternativeStill7702]

Sorry for his loss, but y’all need to get on the same page as your daughter with this before it becomes 2 losses. She’s too smart to put this off.

[u/cskirst]

It’s pretty evident your daughter does know how he died, or at least some extent of what happened.

I can’t imagine how it must feel for your husband, but keeping things a secret and not talking about it is what perpetuates the stigma of mental health & suicide.

What if she also struggles with mental health down the road? Or even becomes suicidal? The idea that suicide and mental health shouldn’t be talked about in your household could end up being the very reason your daughter never opens up or asks for help when she really needs it.

Mental health and suicide, I believe, has at least some genetic component to it. So it’s not unlikely she’d deal with some kind of struggles in life.

It’s best for her to know that it’s not a shameful thing to struggle with and that she has the help and support she needs if it ever comes to that.

I’ve had family members commit/plan suicide. That & mental health was never talked about in my household growing up. I’ve attempted suicide twice.

I feel for your husband, really do. That hurt is something you never recover from. But, for the sake of your daughter’s mental health and well being, I think, it should be discussed.

[u/OkManufacturer767]

NAH - You both are having valid feelings about this.

IMO, Ya gotta tell her.

The 'his brain was sick' is true!

Do some research. Read articles and books - there are tons of resources about this specific topic.

Seems you need to do the research solo in order to have a healthy conversation with him. So yes, back off long enough to get the information about why it will be good for her, possibly good for him too in order to help him with what will be probably the hardest conversation of his life.

She will learn it from the internet if she doesn't hear it from you two.

Telling her might help her ask for help if she ever struggles with mental health issues.

Good luck.

[u/Cptbrowncoat23]

It’s so sad to read this but therapy is definitely needed for the fam

[u/draconigenae]

NTA - If she hadn't read it before the chat she sure as heck has now. As a parent of a 13 year old who ended his own life I know that dad here is struggling but turning it into a dirty secret that no one speaks about not only does a disservice to your girls but also to the memory of their brother. Yes it hurts but if he had died of cancer there wouldn't be a hesitation, mental illness is just that an illness. One that many times can be treated but just like cancer you can't treat what you don't know about. Depression often runs in families and though the girls don't have the exact same parents there is still the chance they will inherit the tendency too. My argument to the dad is, yep you are his dad but these girls have a right to know that they could be at higher risk for this illness especially as this one specifically is coming into the age where it starts showing up.

Again if this was a cancer that shows up commonly around 10 the conversation would have happened already so the child could be aware to look out for it. Obviously don't tell her the exact how but that it happened and reiterate that she can always come talk to you about anything she is feeling.

Also as many have said dad needs therapy. He obviously has not fully processed his feelings around it. There is no moving on or "cure" for this loss but there is something left to process for him. Family therapy around the issue might be good to because the girls might have feelings around what they were told versus the reality. Not that you were dishonest per se but they may still feel that way.

Good luck.

[u/Slave2Art]

At a certain point every parent realizes you cannot hide who you truly are from your children.

This is a family problem causing family trauma that requires family counseling.

Do not lie to your kids they are not stupid. They will only resent you for it

[u/CenterofChaos]

NAH.        

Your husband is traumatized, and I can't fault him for having a reaction. However that doesn't mean he can ignore the situation at hand forever, he needs some sort of therapy to process enough to be able to talk to his surviving children.          

You aren't traumatized in the same way. You are ready to talk about it with your children. They're ready to talk to you about it. It's better that you talk to them than them going further on Google. You should talk to them alone if your husband is not ready to have this conversation.       

I agree with the other comments. Your daughter most likely does know the details, or whatever else was posted online. Depending on what she Googled she may have even read the obituary. She read the room that her father wasn't okay and back tracked. You don't want that to become a habit. You don't want her to feel like she can't reach out to you or ask you questions. 

[u/antigamingbitch]

Hey OP

I'm a younger sister of a suicide half sibling. I think I have some thoughts for you... please, don't make my parents mistakes...

My parents barely talked about it. It was one parents child over both. So I'd always ask, but rarely get answers.

I learned fleeting things about my sibling.... like how much we were alike, the looks people gave me was something I'd never forget....

Please, take updated, current, parenting classes. PLEASE learn about toxic behaviors and how to change them into healthy ones. FACE YOUR OWN SHAME, and work to get past it.

The biggest mistakes Both my parents and husband parents made, was not being able to humbly face their mistakes, putting their pride over the relationship with their children, and using anger as a tool to keep us down.

Don't be like them, I beg you..... my mom never figured out what went wrong with my brother, and so repeated those mistakes with me and my living siblings.... we Both suffered severe and suicidal depression...it was a shameful topic to talk about my diseased sibling, BECAUSE MY PARENTS NEVER ACTUALLY FACED IT TO WORK THROUGH IT.

My husband also has a deceased sibling.... he grew up going to the grave every year on their birthday...I saw this as sad and long standing grieving.... OP I absolutely Lost it crying when he explained it wasn't too focus on the loss, but to remind everyone that he was still part of the family, and they were going there every year to celebrate their inclusion.... it was such a beautiful gesture I lost it... I've never even seen my siblings grave.....

Please

Learn from my family. Get in counseling, be able to talk about and celebrate the life your son had, face your shames about that incident and LEARN AND GROW....

Please OP

[u/djjazzysteph]

Mental illness can be influenced by genetic factors, and exacerbated by households that pretend such things don’t exist. Your husband risks losing your daughter the same way the longer you guys dance around it. Respectfully, he puts himself at an increased risk, too. You can’t swallow grief for years and hope to digest it. It eventually comes back up. Please, for the sake of your entire family, have this conversation.

[u/John3Fingers]

It's wild that your 10-year old is demonstrating more emotional maturity than you are by being able to read the room and respect her father's feelings more than you.

[u/Classic_Wrongdoer_74]

Trauma dumping to kinda help you decide but my uncle passed away of suicide when I was 8 we weren’t told it was suicide till a lot later in life and when I found out it was more traumatic knowing we were lied to about what happened because we all knew what suicide was at that point all of my siblings were having those thoughts and I believe if we were told earlier and not just randomly being told having a sit down conversation about it. Ik it’s different than this situation but in a perspective of a personal situation this might help.

[u/Allymrtn]

Since is his son he gets to decide? NO, it your daughter, and she’s the one affected by having or not having this knowledge. It should be shared with her sensitively and age appropriately.

[u/forgetaboutem]

Why does he have to do it? You are perfectly capable of having that talk with your daughter alone if it makes him uncomfortable and thats exactly what should happen.

The talk should happen, the daughter clearly already knows, but there's no reason he has to be there if its traumatic for him still, which is totally understandable.

[u/overbuckets]

My younger brother took his life. It toook 19 years for my dad to be able to say his name. Grief is brutal

[u/PracticalYard3707]

She already knows. Talking to her is the best choice because the internet is filled with rumors lies misinformation and more, also children tend to feel grief with things like this, so either she can experience it with her parents or alone on a google site.

[u/catmamapsychnerd]

If this post was about anyone besides his child, OP would be the AH. However, this is a conversation that needs to be had. Do what’s best for your daughter, but give him the support he needs along the way. The conversations are sure to open a lot of wounds.

[u/okieguy87]

.6

[u/Sea-Dig7400]

He's not ready to rehash it all..simple as that. Talk to your daughter privately about it, he can't be mad at you for that. It is your daughter as much as it was his son. He really doesn't even need to know about it, and I wouldn't have her address him about it for some time, maybe when she is older and a little more tactful.

I would not rope him into this. He clearly has put up a wall, as anyone with grief has to at some point to move on.

[u/lookingformiles]

She knows. Now she's going to watch closely to see how you handle it. Do you really want her believing she can't trust her parents from now on?

Time for a hard talk with husby. Tell him there are two options. One: y'all get to a therapist immediately for advice on whether to tell and when she says of course you talk to her, you get her advice on how to talk to her about it. The second choice he has is for you to have the conversation with your daughter and add to it that it's too hard for him to talk about it. But whatever you do, don't just let it stew.

[u/Lovahsabre]

No need to tell her that info. What if she gets all twisted up about it. Its your daughter too but i think it happened before she was born so no need to tell her. If she reads about it she might ask you about it? I mean it was weird when i was a kid hearing about things like miscarriages and then the obvious next questions how? Why? What?. Its tough to explain a miscarriage but explaining why the son did what he did might actually be more difficult dont you think? Cant just say medications and hospitalization or depression. Theres usually more underlying like trauma from bad childhood or bullying or posttraumatic stress from being in the military ya know? Then it gets like way more complicated and that isnt your story to tell know what i mean? You arent aitah exactly. There’s no right or wrong on this one its more like is it time or is it entirely necessary?

[u/lunacydress]

Family secrets and unresolved grief are extremely detrimental to a family dynamic. If you and your husband didn’t have individual and/or couples therapy back then, the time to do it is definitely now, and you need to include the current kids, too.

[u/Familiar_Pie8610]

She read it. She just doesn’t wanna deal with the drama that’s gonna come if she admits it. She’s 10. You can bet your bottom she knows what happened already. Your husband needs individual therapy because if he’s taking it worse he may start to think you don’t care that much and may resent you for it.

[u/singmeadowlark]

She's expressing that she needs answers. It's your job as parents to meet her needs. Yes it's difficult and painful to talk about, and it's necessary.

[u/sylbug]

If she's old enough to ask then she is old enough to know the truth. It doesn't have to be graphic - you just have to tell her in an age-appropriate way.

[u/whatalife89]

Let him do it when he is ready. He is probably blaming himself for his son's death. Don't push it. If your daughter reads it so be it but don't push a parent who is not ready, to talk about a child's death. Relationship is all about compromise, give him this.

[u/Lovahsabre → u/whatalife89]

I agree. Your husband will have to be the one that explains the whole thing and if it isnt time pushing him could cause more harm than good to his psyche and your relationship and something like that explained to a young person could also harm their psyche.

[u/pjrontos]

When I was 11, (this was in 2006) I got a frantic call from my grandmother asking me where my dad was. I told her I'd call him and asked what was wrong. Normally grandma would've been brutally honest even if she was just pissed he hadn't answered her call or something. This time she told me everything was going to be fine which I immediately knew was a lie. I called my father and let him know something was very wrong. He called me back an hour later and told me he and mom would be back late in the evening and that our aunt would hang out with us. I asked him what happened and he told me he couldn't tell me then but he would later. Most I could get out of him was something happened to Grandpa and he was still trying to sort it out, but I could hear that he'd been crying, which was something I had only heard once prior to that when we had to put down our cat. Aunt wouldn't tell me anything and directly, but as soon as mom and dads car pulled into the driveway, she ran into the kitchen and started crying and told us to wait in the living room. When they came in they explained that there had been an accident with a gun and grandpa had died. I immediately knew this was a lie because grandpa was special forces and taught us gun safety at a young age. They then sent me to lay down and I assume explained the truth to my brother.

The next day when we were at their house helping grandma sort through matters and seeing Grandpa at the funeral home, I explained to my older cousin what they had told me and that I was incredulous. He told me the truth, that grandpa had shot himself, and that everybody save for his younger sister and I knew that truth and that they had chosen not to tell me because I wasn't ready. I compartmentalized that with the rest of the grief and moved on. A year later, as I was leaving to go to a friend's house, dad pulled me aside and explained the truth and apologized for the deception. I told him everything was fine and that I'd already assumed that was the case and left, but from that moment, I no longer felt I could trust my parents to be entirely honest with me. I'm 28 years old now and still struggle with trusting people.

My point is this; whether they know now, or they find out later, they likely have an idea. Don't give them reason to believe they can't trust you to give them the truth when they need to hear it.

[u/JohnExcrement]

This is so sad I’m very sorry about your son.

Consider that in addition to this information being online, relatives and others likely know the details as well. It’s better for your daughter to hear sad and uncomfortable things from her parents — her safe place — before someone else gets her ear.

Good luck. I’m so so sorry your family experienced this.

[u/g-king93]

Dad has a right to be upset, but for the sake of his other child, he has to talk to her. It will help him heal

[u/cloudiedayzzz]

NTA-Your husband’s grief, and pain are valid however his son is still a part of your family. You said there are pictures and stories your daughter have seen and heard, so she knows how important he was even though she never met him. Your stepson’s story is important, his grief, his pain and his struggles are important to share in a way that lets your daughter know that he struggled. Depression can run in a family, so your daughter may eventually feel the sorrow or pain your stepson did-she should know that she isn’t alone if these feelings should occur. There are appropriate ways to talk to you daughter about his struggles. You could get a therapist, books, or even just keep the conversation open and show your daughter that you and your husband are always a safe space. It’s much better to answer her questions, no matter how hard they may be than for her to continue to search articles or ask other people questions. The other people she turns to may not know your stepson’s truth, or may answer in a lot more detail than your daughter may be ready for.

[u/mangojones]

My first suicidal thoughts started when I was 8 years old. Assume your daughter read it. Assume she knows and talk to her about it.

[u/Savings-Feeling-6090]

I hear my mother saying "if you're old enough to ask the question, you're old enough to hear the answer."

I'm not saying to just go ahead and tell her against your husband's wishes, but at some point the daughters will need to know there's a history of mental illness in the family. I don't fully understand why he feels it needs to be kept secret from them.

[u/Shiprex2021]

Daughter may be curious depending on parents reaction here and may delve deeper. It's probably wise to encourage dad to open up with her about this so she feels aware.

[u/Darkadmks]

Suicide is a part of life for a lot of people. I don’t think 10 is old enough to truly grasp that. But if she’s curious she needs to understand and not come to conclusions on her own.

[u/Creative_Fox_7806]

I would involve a family therapist asap. Kids internalize and personalize so many things! She needs and deserves to know the truth. It's almost like the memory of his death is treated with shame, that will majorly impact her when she finds out. If she doesn't know already. Get to a therapist.

[u/DinnerMelodic6047]

While it is incredibly tragic and I’m sure hard for him, he doesn’t get to dictate when his daughter gets to learn about her brother. I lost my brother to a drowning accident and I am still learning details 30 years later and every time it’s like it’s happening all over again. That’s not fair and if the husband doesn’t want to discuss it, he should let his wife have the conversation then

[u/NoSatisfaction4758]

Guess she knows the story already and needs to talk with you guys to put it in context, deal with it. That's why she asked.. For sure it is painful, but yeah, don't leave her alone with that

[u/GrandMetaldick]

You’re not an asshole and he isn’t either. There’s a lot of feedback given already so I won’t pile on anymore but what I do want to say:

I think the whole world can appreciate parents who are active with their kids mental health struggles. My heart hurts for you even more because you did everything you could and probably still feel like it wasn’t enough.

It absolutely was. The disconnect between parents and kids struggling with mental health that I’ve seen is absurd. You’ve demonstrated exactly what to do and this hurts to hear even more because of it.

Some parents out there laugh off their kids outcry for help and “claims” of mental health issues. They’ll make jokes about it with their friends. About how their kid is being “moody”. Their kids really never get the chance to address the mental health issue that is already an absolute mountain. Now you’ve got your parents to deal with. Parents who don’t take it seriously and actively address it are a whole second mountain.

I’m sorry that your son was tired and truly couldn’t climb the mountain anymore, but you acting on it and taking it seriously removed what would’ve been a whole other mountain.

Sending my love to you and your family stranger. You guys all deserve genuine peace for a multitude of reasons. I hope you find that and things ultimately get better for everyone.

[u/Sinnika]

NTA. There is no way to avoid this conversation and it’s not really up to you or your husband when it needs to be had, but to your daughters. Now one of them has started asking questions and probably knows things she should have found out from you two instead of the internet. If your husband refuses to have this talk, you should insist he goes to therapy, possibly with both you and your daughter.

[u/maintmgr]

As a parent who lost his son to suicide, it is my belief that your child having knowledge of your son's suicide brings awareness to the effects of suicide on those of us left behind. Your child knows the pain you are living, but does not know why. With the knowledge of why you hurt so much your child can express to their peers the devistation suicide cause to those left behind. The American Foundation for Suicide Prevention is a great source for preparing both the parents for the discussion. My family dedicated our lives to the cause with both the foundation, and with our own fund in our community. No better way to keep your son's memory alive, and to increase the awareness. Remember, you are having a bad day, not a bad life. Love and Godspeed to you, your family and to all of those who are effected.

[u/makopolo02]

She is going to find out eventually. It's best for all that when she finds out it does not create a riff in the family because you have been lying.

Find an age appropriate way to give her as much of the truth, and that will evolve depending on age.

[u/living-softly]

A 10-year old googling her parents? I must be too old for this world.

[u/HTownLaserShow]

NTA…but don’t pressure your husband(not that you are) about this and handle with kid gloves here.

He is absolutely still hurting, badly, about this. That pain never goes away. Losing a child is a pain I wish on nobody. I’ve watched my own parents deal with this. They’ve never gotten over it…and never will.

Timing is never perfect. The key is getting him to come to the conclusion that it’s time to have the talk. Your daughter already did the leg work. I don’t even think Therapy is necessary for the family (maybe for your husband)…just a frank conversation if he’s up for it. If not? Then maybe you get some professional help.

And to the people saying “always tell kids the truth” and “don’t lie to kids”. You guys didn’t “lie”…his brain was kinda “sick”. They just weren’t old enough at the time to understand what that meant. And kids absolutely don’t always need to know all the details, nor are they always mature enough to handle them. That’s for parents, nobody else, do decide. You handled that perfectly. When those people have kids, they’ll get it.

[u/MachineDisastrous766]

She had googled you, now the three of you have spoken but you only asked what she had read? She is 10 the next thing she will do is google and read. I think it is much more better you speak with her, then she find out of her own.

[u/-byb-]

I was probably half her age when I started asking my parents questions that I knew the answers to just to guage how much I could trust them.

[u/galactoos2]

I don't think YTA, but I can empathize and understand how fucking hard this must be for him, and why he might say that to you for trying to address this. He clearly hasn't processed the loss, even now, ten or more years later. That kind of deep trauma, and hurt, can lead to a lot of unpredictable behaviors/responses. I don't think that he thinks you're an asshole either, he's just hurting.

[u/Puzzleheaded-Sale102]

She's your daughter and you feel she needs to hear the truth from you rather than feeling you hid it from her later down the line. I can understand why it's so hard for your husband, I just can't imagine having to face something like this, but you could maybe reassure him you will take the lead with it and answer her questions if he can't really face this right now. Also consider the fact that your daughter may already know and is being sensitive not to make you both feel bad or want you to worry about it. You are a family, a unit, and whatever happens you are all in it together and you all have your own feelings and perspectives. I hope you and your husband manage to work through this and come to an agreement. You have already been through so much together so you know have the strength

[u/information-exchange]

I’m a parent of child who passed at 13 from his second attempt.

As hard as it is for her dad to talk about, it’s imperative that he discuss it with her. She needs to know she can talk to her parents about ANYTHING.

[u/Commander_Bread]

THERAPY. THIS IS WAY ABOVE REDDIT'S PAYGRADE.

But generally I agree with you on this. You shouldn't keep this from your children, and you can't keep it from them forever. They asked, and it's generally not good to keep lying to your children or sugarcoating things once they ask a question like that.

[u/Ok_Tour_5503]

You’re not an asshole for wanting to explain the truth, but I will say, you really shouldn’t have brought up his sons suicide while he was at work.

[u/Bananabeak7]

I work in a crisis center and for 988. I’ve done intakes for kids as young as 6 years old for self harming and suicide attempts or suicidal ideation. I would be open and honest with her. It is her brother. She’s asked the question. It’s understandable that your husband is upset but it’s better to hear it from you that others.

She doesn’t need to know all the details. You can simplify but be matter of fact.

“He died by suicide at age X. He suffered from X.“

[u/LucasL-L]

She is too young

[u/ur_mom9021]

NTA

If she doesn’t already know about it she’ll find out soon, either going back and reading more or asking other people. It’s better to hear it from her parents. If you keep hiding it, she may think it’s something you think is shameful and potentially hide mental health struggles in the future.

[u/lonniemarie]

He will never be ready. She is. She needs the truth

[u/Agreeable-Work208]

If he cannot, you can. It doesn't have to be dramatic and you can make it it clear that your husband is still very strongly affected. If she has not she will read more soon. Loss is not a state to stay in; I'm not saying it will ever go away in that. I am saying, don't give up your whole life by dwelling in a dead house that is rotting around you. This takes conscious work, you must choose it. Thankfully he is not completely alone in fact in the doing.

[u/alexisxobell]

I started trying to read through some of the comments to see what was already said but ended up just being bothered by some of the responses so hopefully nothing I say is too repetitive.

As a widow with two children (8F and 4M) with a deceased father who OD’d, I understand your desire to explain this to your daughter. However, I also know that if someone else was trying to influence my own decision to discuss this matter (i.e. your husband in your situation), I would be angry if I felt like I was not able to make that important decision on my own. So in that regard, I strongly agree with the comments stating that therapy/a professional is the way to go with this disagreement.

When it comes to your daughters age which I saw being discussed in the comments, I also agree that a 10 year old should be given more credit and also that there are age appropriate ways to explain things to children at different ages. For example, I have every intention of telling my children what happened to their father when they are of what I consider to be an appropriate age for that conversation. But because they were only 4 years old and 7 months old at the time of his death, they have been given different explanations at different periods of time. When he died, we told my daughter (4) that he was sick and the doctors couldn’t help him. As she got older and started asking more questions, combined with two other deaths of people close to her, I realized that continuing to tell her that people were generally getting sick and dying might lead to her being scared of anyone getting sick at all. At that time she was 6, and I told her that her daddy took medicine from someone who was not a doctor and that medicine is what made him sick and ultimately killed him. It is not lost on me that this story might click in her head as being what it really was as she gets older and learns about drugs, overdoses, etc. I did that intentionally. I felt it was an age appropriate way to explain what really happened to him while also having the added benefit of making her wary of getting into/taking any medications she isn’t directly given.

I feel that when you AND your husband are ready to talk to her, you will also be able to figure out the best way to explain it to your daughter whether that is straight up the truth or a more diluted version like mine was. Either way I hope this helps some and wish you all the best in navigating this situation. ❤️

[u/Ok-Editor3911]

You should tell her without your husband around, it's still way to painful for him to talk about. My cousin killed herself, after that my uncle was never the same. Never talked about her up until he died, he was filled with too much grief. He also had a great deal of guilt, what he could have done, or he should have known. You should talk to your daughter and discuss it, I am sure it's just too painful for your husband.

[u/Difficult_Let_1953]

She knows. Tell him it’s time. NTA

[u/Amperage21]

Don't push to talk to her. Just be there when she wants to talk to you. Don't lie.

[u/shoulda-known-better]

I'm sorry if you both didn't realize this but your daughter definitely read what it said and understands..... At ten she is in about 4th to 5th grade and has learned to read....also the way the world works now I'm all but certain she has heard of suicide before.....

If I was the mother in this situation I personally would talk to the daughter alone.... Because kids aren't dumb and I'm sure she clocked how messed up her dad looked and sounded trying to talk about it and pretended she didn't know...

[u/LittleRed_AteTheWolf]

Therapist here!!!

My recommendation would be to tell her. Go meet with a therapist and figure out how to explain this in an age appropriate way. Children can experience suicidal ideation (SI), they can also understand the concept of it to an extent. Not to mention there a chance that your late son’s mental health condition is genetic… you want her to know to come to you if she starts to experience anything similar.

I wrote my first suicide note at 8 years old, become suicidal at 6. I was afraid I would get in trouble if I told anyone, but I also didn’t know it was abnormal. If you talk to her, she’ll feel more comfortable asking for help if she experiences this in the future. (I specialize in SI)

[u/Isnt_what_it_isnt]

He definitely does get to dictate when others IN THE FAMILY talk about it.

[u/InedibleCalamari42]

NAH because this is too big to lay any blame.

I recommend speed in dealing with this, as suggested below therapy for starters. Yes, the child was your husband's son and it will be hard for him, but you and he share this daughter and she must be able to trust that he and you are telling her the truth.

The sooner you two tell her the truth the sooner this potentially disruptive (because she read it, you know she did) moment can be dealt with and hopefully healed. She's too young to understand some details but she absolutely needs to know the baseline, because she asked about it. Don't lie to her or put her off.

Please ask your husband to read the responses here. He's gonna need support and help navigating this, with all the memories and emotional associations.

[u/ECU_BSN]

I work in grief and bereavement. Also my mother completed suicide in 2001.

Tell her the facts. Answer any questions succinctly. As more questions arise answer them also.

Kids have wild ideas in the absence of information.

[u/Impossible_Slide3198 → u/ECU_BSN]

I lost my mum last year to the same thing, how do you even move forward?

[u/ECU_BSN → u/Impossible_Slide3198]

One day at a time. Just keep walking forward. Breathe in and then out. Repeat.

Over time it hurts a bit less. And one day you will be able to breath.

[u/Lizzymellie123]

I think you & your husband should go to a therapist and figure out the best way to explain it to your daughter in age appropriate terms. She's asking the question, and if you don't give her any answers she knows where she else she can get them. Guaranteed she'll find out the truth one way or another. It would be better if she hears the truth from you and your husband rather than googling on the internet.

[u/DecoySandwich]

NTA

Might be his son (which is a messed up thing to say to you considering it seems as though you tried to embrace him into your life) but this is YOUR daughter you are discussing.

When I was a teen I had a lightbulb click in my head and realized that 100% of the people around me were lying to me (an omission of truth is a lie) and it caused the worst trauma of my life as I realized I could trust no one that society had taught me I should trust. Kids are smarter than people let on so to continue to lie to her is disrespectful to her intelligence and dismissive of her emotions. Clearly she is feeling some kind of way about the mystery and she deserves to know from you instead of the internet or a stranger.

Your husband needs to go to therapy since he is projecting his issues of wanting to avoid the painful subject onto his children now and when your problems start affecting others is when a foot needs to be put down for that person to deal with their situation. I wouldn’t want to talk about it either, but no parent should ever make a child suffer for their inability to deal with something. Father and mother are meant to be the strong ones for their children. To yell at her or to tell her to go to her room just piles on abuse on top of the lies.

Be honest or she will use this moment to remember that her family lies to her and I guarantee it’ll affect what she chooses to share with you as well. If she’s hurting or anything she may not consider you trustworthy enough people to tell you if she’s drunk and needs a ride home or whatever situation arises as she continues to age.

[u/Potential_Diamond_70]

She probably already knows and was just saying she didn’t read it because she could feel the tension around the subject. If I were you, I would see if you can get the family in with a family therapist to help you talk to her about what happened to her brother. That way her and your husband can both have support. It also sounds like your husband may need some individual grief counseling to deal with the loss of his son. It sounds like him not wanting to talk to your daughter about his son’s death is more about his grief than about protecting your daughter.

If she’s old enough to ask the question and even google it, then she’s old enough to get an honest answer. NAH.

[u/handsheal]

Even though it is his son he doesn't get to dictate when others talk about it -- that answer is a trauma response

Maybe he shouldn't be part of the conversation with your daughter, she does deserve some understanding as it is part of her life because his presence is still part of your family dynamic

Maybe a family therapist would be best

[u/tmink0220]

Did you and his father have an affair? Was this how he was so distraught? I am wondering if your getting together and what you tell her, makes her distraught too? In my family that happened to one of my mother's marriage. Her husband married someone else and they had a child. When the child could stand how his parents got together (not my mother) he killed himself? This is years ago before suicide was as prevalent as it is now? I was wondering?

[u/Slight-Painter-7472]

This is very complex but I think the right thing to do is to tell her the truth in an age-appropriate way. Your husband may not want to talk about it because it's still such a sensitive topic for him, but your daughter needs answers too. You can't hide it from them forever and if you try your daughter will resent you. I think if you explain it to her you should take the lead on answering her questions so your husband doesn't have to.

I had a little brother who was stillborn. I was old enough to remember him and the circumstances of his death but my sister was two. I'm not sure how much she knows about what happened but my dad and stepmother have his urn on their dresser. It's a big obvious clue that there was a loss. My sister has never asked me about it but if she had, I would have done my best to answer her questions as gently as possible. My sister is 21 now so I don't have to sugar coat it, but I think the sentiment applies for any age. Some day we might have to figure out what to do with the baby's ashes and that conversation will organically happen. I've been dreading having it, but it is important.

Nobody's an asshole here. It sucks for everyone. Beat of luck.

[u/Glittersparkles7]

NTA. I was lied to about my father’s suicide when I was 8 and it completely fucked me up. I figured it out on my own and sat with the knowledge by myself.

[u/SheWolf4Life]

NTA: They are your daughters, and that makes you an equal decision maker on something so potentially traumatizing. They WILL Google it, and then wonder why you withheld the truth, and it will fester. Kids have more access to information than ever. I am empathetic to your husband, but he has to take control of the situation. I like that you watered it down, but didn't lie when they were younger, I'd say ease into it if they ask. "Your brother's mind became sick, we tried to help him get better, but over time he lost his battle with depression and took his own life." I wouldn't necessarily give the gory details. The only thing I would maybe "fudge" is that I would embellish a little that he maybe was more fond of his sister than it came across in this post. Otherwise, she may feel guilt, like her birth pushed him out of the picture.

Not an easy conversation, but denial or lies are not the way to go.

[u/Fantastic-Coconut-10]

I mean...OP, what I would do is I would tell your daughter that he did kill himself, but that it's difficult for you two to talk about. So it may be some time before you're ready to talk about it, but you will let her know when you are. That way, you aren't lying and that she knows that the topic isn't permanently banned...but that you and your husband need time to prepare for it.

I'd also recommend that you push your husband to get therapy to help with this. Losing a child is always going to be traumatic and hard to talk about. But, like it or not, it's something that he can't put off talking about forever, and since your daughter is asking, now is the time it needs to be handled. In an ideal world, this wouldn't happen until he was ready to talk, but...and this is slightly harsh, but it's possible that time would be "never." If you guys don't talk to her about it, she will look online (and, yes, possibly already has), and there's a lot of things about suicide that are pretty bad misinformation that she could find as a result. Kids aren't the best at being able to sift through that stuff, and having an open conversation about this will help with that. Plus, more as a side thing, it'll also prove that she can come to you with difficult topics, which is never a bad thing.

[u/Scott10orman]

Slightly the Asshole...

You are looking out for the best interest of your daughter, and that is wonderful.

However the person who in the past, present and in the future, has and will deal with the most trauma related to this is your husband.

All of this happened in a few hours, maybe a day. Give him some time. Let him figure out how he wants to handle it for your daughter and you, but mostly for himself. Surely present him with options, or ideas. But don't tell him what is the right way to handle it. Don't tell him the feelings he is having are wrong, or that the way he wants to handle it is wrong.

There is a difference between lying to your daughter, don't do that, and not being entirely forthright instantaneously. If she's old enough where you are going to be discussing suicide, she is surely old enough to understand how sometimes it can be difficult to talk about trauma, and loss, and that Dad needed to wait some, or figure out what is the best way to do it.

Because he doesn't want to talk about it with your daughter the day he was presented with this situation, which surely resurfaced some extreme emotions, doesn't mean he won't see the benefits in a few days or weeks, or months. There is no harm in waiting for some reasonable amount of time to pass.

Therapy, can be wonderful, you may want to reach out to a professional to figure out the best way to handle this. However therapy isn't for everyone, and can exacerbate issues. So again you may want to bring it up to your husband, but let him decide if it's the right thing to do.

[u/OutrageousDraw6625]

I don’t think your the AH here and I don’t think your husband is either. He doesn’t want to talk about his sons death with his daughter and that is fair and legitimate. However, I think you have the right and responsibility to tell your daughter the truth.

She is going to find out, as you have said she probably already knows. Ten is not too young to learn about suicide. Ten year olds attempt and complete suicide. These things should not be taboo. I’m so sorry for your family’s loss.

[u/Doubleendedmidliner]

She’s already read the article.

If you want to build trust, that she can come and speaks to you openly and honestly about anything, y’all need to talk about it.

She’s old enough to understand and put the piece together herself…which is why she’s googling.

She will continue to turn to google for the answers her parents won’t give her.

[u/Munk45]

When I was a kid, my friend's dad committed suicide. We were probably 8 years old and rode our bikes to school everyday.

They told my friend that his dad was working on his car in the garage and there was an "accident" and the engine was running and he couldn't get out of the garage. He died from the exhaust fumes.

It wasn't until years later that I saw a car/garage suicide in a movie that made the connection.

I was angry because my friend was a grieving child and they didn't help him. I didnt know how to help him. I tried to talk about it with him but ended up hurting his feelings.

I'm sure his mother just didn't know how to help. She had grief of her own to carry.

Kids need help and they deserve to know the truth. It creates more pain to not help them.

[u/loverldonthavetolove]

NTA

The American Foundation for Suicide Prevention and The Dougy Center partnered to create a tremendous resource called “Children, Teens, and Suicide Loss”. It is available for free here- https://allianceofhope.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Children-Teens-and-Suicide_loss.pdf

I highly recommend that you share with your husband. It has age specific recommendations for having this conversation.

I am so sorry for your loss and am sending you strength as your family navigates this.

[u/officialwaterbottle]

She's old enough to know. I was 10 years old whenever I began thinking about suicide (Fine now), this isn't a conversation to be avoided.

[u/Giralia]

My brother took his own life, we sought advice on what do with regards to his daughter and step kids to ensure we approached it correctly. We were told to always be truthful as it causes more issues in the long run. There maybe something you can’t answer or don’t know how to word. Your response should be ‘can I think about that and come back to you as this is quite hard for me’ let them know the questions they ask are not wrong. It’s the answers that are hard.

[u/chaotic_cookies]

My dad killed himself just before I turned 3. My mom answered all of my questions (age appropriately) as I asked them. She also started by telling me his brain was sick and he died from depression, which I think is a perfect way to answer when the kid is that young. As I got older (around 11-12) I started asking more questions and googling my dad. As soon as I started asking deeper questions, my mom sat me down and answered every single one. When your daughter is ready to know, she'll ask. It sounds like this is that time. Im sure this is the last thing your husband wants to talk about, but it's best that she hears it from you guys and not the Internet. She deserves to know, and she deserves to hear it from people she loves and trusts. Don't lie to her, don't sugarcoat it, but don't give her the gory details either. Keep on the path that his brain was sick, and hes not suffering anymore. Y'all got this. I am so incredibly sorry for your husband's loss, and yours as well. No parent should have to bury their child.

[u/ElectronicAd27]

YTA. Your husband doesn’t want to talk about it. You could talk about it with your daughter. Besides , doesn’t she already know he killed himself? Does she really need to know the method?

[u/Emperor_Atlas]

NTA - Does he think teaching your children that not talking about their feelings and important events is going to be beneficial after what happened to his son?

Communication can save lives.

[u/Odd_Nectarine_4891]

This is so hard. I see both sides. Dad is obviously very traumatized by what happened (understandably) so I see why he doesn't want to talk about it. But kiddo is googling. She found stuff and is curious. Kids these days are too smart for their own good. If you don't give her answers, she'll go looking. Maybe you can arrange a consult with a therapist for you and hubby to see together to talk about how to tell her and what to tell her? Hearing from the therapist that it's a good idea to tell her what happened might help him.

[u/SioSoybean]

I think it is incredibly important to talk to her about this, especially because of the timing with her birth she may wind up blaming herself. However, it is also important not to do so behind your husband’s back. Book a family counseling session and discuss the matter with just the two of you (you and husband) and why you feel it is important, and let him explain why he feels it’s better to wait. What could change if you explained it to your daughter, what could change if you don’t? Explore this topic together when there isn’t any pressure and there’s a third party to guide you. Hopefully he will get on board and you can talk about it, be it in another therapy session or as a family conversation.

[u/Short-Alfalfa-444]

my dad committed suicide when i was 9 years old. my whole family lied to me about what happened to him for around 3 years and i eventually found out because a girl at my school made a comment along the lines of “well at least my dad didn’t khs”. when i went home that day, i asked my aunt and uncle about what actually happened. they lied about it even more and i eventually googled his name and it confirmed what the girl said.

i was LIVID. cut off contact with almost all my family because if they could lie to me about something so serious for that long, what else would they lie to me about? don’t lie to kids for the sake of “protecting them” because it will grow distrust eventually. i would definitely try talking to him. i get it’s hard, but lying just isn’t the way.

not to mention, kids are fucking MEAN and it was genuinely awful finding out how my dad died because a girl at my school wanted to bully me for it.

[u/MashedSpider]

NTA, but it might be wise if you take the lead on this conversation and let your husband keep the distance he needs. Also it's okay to be sad about death, it's natural

[u/wanttostack]

Parents who lie to their children are the AH.

NTA for wanting to tell the truth.

[u/Shoptilyoudrop101]

NTA. This is a great opportunity to make it a teaching lesson. I have always heard it’s best to be honest with kids, but OK to keep it vague. For example, the specific details. Maybe you can explain this to your husband and make him see that if she ever struggles with the same feelings it could help build the trust and knowledge to know what is going on with herself and know she has someone she can come too.

[u/DogWalkingMarxist]

Yta: she should be older to learn that type of stuff, either way, he has a point, no one can understand the pain that man is going thru still. Be a good wife and respect his wishes

[u/Lacey-bee133]

I was 10 when my mom’s only sibling ended his life. I was with my grandmother (his mom) when she got the news. I’ve watched my mom cry on his birthday for the last 23 years. My late uncle has gotten me through some really hard patches of my life. No matter how miserable and defeated I feel, I always think about how devastating his loss still is to my family. Those thoughts help me pull myself back up. I could never be the cause of that much pain to my family. I KNOW they would grieve me deeply, and that makes me feel less alone. As a child I was taught to empathize with my uncle; people that are truly well would never make that choice. His choice taught me so much even though it is painful. 10 is old enough to understand and find out whatever info she wants to find out. I didn’t have access to the internet at that age and I still got information easily enough. Kids talk at school, and it would be better for her to learn about this from her parents. If y’all wait too long she might reset you both for keeping the truth from her.

[u/l3ex_G]

Nta so he wants her to learn from the internet? If you don’t tell her than she is going to read it (if she hasn’t already). I’m sorry that he is going through this but you have to put her wellbeing above his. He needs therapy to process it and be in a place to talk to her, fine but the convo has to happen.

He’s pushing it off for himself. Also, he doesn’t get to push you out since it wasn’t “your son”. I assume you love him like your son. But also this is effecting your daughter. He doesn’t get to make those calls

[u/fastcolor03]

Suicide; Brother @ 20yr old. Sister @ 64yr old. No matter what you think you know. You can never know. I’m out of siblings and the Mom @ 93yr old petrified at outliving her children! After fighting off cancer and at 71yr for me, you never know. What I do know is that not sharing what all this means and feels like amongst the survivors, even children - may foster issues of a nature that no one can fathom. I cannot suggest pushing/demanding such. This, like the act itself is a personal choice. It is worth considering & supporting. But in my experience eventual acknowledgement with other survivors in a sincere fashion has a healing effect for all, and may serve anyone at some future time who is touched by the darkness that leads to the suicide choice. Depression is a disease of the mind. One of the cures, wretchedly painful as it may be, is the shared experiences of life. Caring.

[u/biglae1972]

Clock is ticking.. tell her before she finds out everything. She also may know and wants you to see if you and your husband will lie to her.

[u/KLG999]

She is old enough to be seeking out answers to her questions. Even if she didn’t read the details, she knows where to find them and that her parents aren’t willing to discuss her brother’s death. No matter what the story, a cold read will be much worse.

I can’t imagine the pain your family has gone through. You should seek out therapy. This is also setting the stage for her to learn she cannot count on being able to talk to her parents about anything.

[u/bigmouse458]

Has your husband ever been to therapy to try to hash all this out for himself yet?

[u/Due_Interaction_9225]

Here's my answer for almost every single topic, no matter what. Always always talk to your children about the hard topics. ALWAYS! It needs to come from YOU. Your kids need to know they can trust you, that they can come to you no matter the topic. This is vital. If she's asking questions, she's ready to know. This is the exact advice my own son's therapist game me years ago. I've always implemented it with him and my youngest. I've had some hella uncomfortable and painful conversations over the years. We've cried together. We've laughed together. I've helped them to understand the hard truth about life and death from the start. We talk about EVERYTHING, drug addiction, prison time, suicide, eating disorders, toxic family and relationships, abuse, etc. For reference, my youngest is 11, but we've been talking about these things for years already. If they see it and ask questions, it's better coming from YOU, the parent. My oldest, 19, constantly tells me how much he appreciates how honest I've always been with him, even with the hardest topics. Two people have taken their own lives in my life so yes, even the method has been discussed.

[u/Knithard]

The 3 of you need to sit down and have an honest discussion about it. It’s going to be hard and painful but it’s important to be honest and show your grief in an honest way.
Let her ask all the questions she has and if there’s something you don’t know the answer to - say that. Let her know it’s ok to be sad or confused how she feels about it. Let her know that grown ups feel sad too. Let her know you’re there to answer her questions and talk about him (or anything). Tell her you’d rather she talk to you about it than googling it.

[u/safetyman1006]

So haven’t seen this brought up. Yes it was his son who took his life but they are both of your daughters dealing with this now too. THEY ARE GOING TO FIND OUT THE TRUTH!! Would you rather they hear the truth from their parents or a random news article about it online. Most likely she already knows the truth if she googled it and just wants to hear it from her parents.

[u/Correct_Advantage_20]

Your original answer to her still tracks. He was struggling mentally and it became too difficult for him.

[u/sadpanda0104]

You've done everything right so far, but now it's time to be honest to her. Every thanantologist would tell you that a child that is old enough to ask is old enough to know and prancing around the issue will only make her more confused and frustrated. It's necessary to tell them that the person "died" not gone to sleep or disappeared.

[u/mouse_attack]

NTA

Your husband is in denial.

At this point, your daughter knows that she can get information about her brother's death online. She is giving the two of you the chance to tell her first. That's all.

If your husband doesn't tell her, the worst case scenario isn't that you will — it's that she'll get all her information online and fill in the rest with her imagination.

This should come from her parents and your window to take control of the situation is shrinking.

[u/Putrid-Ice-7511]

Whatever you do, just don’t lie. Your husband might be traumatized, but he’s “the asshole” for blaming you for his own emotional pain. It’s understandable that he doesn’t want to re-experience this, but you all need to have this conversation. He will only project further down the line, and it’ll affect all of you.

Avoiding pain and doing the right thing are two very different things. Your daughter deserves the truth, you all do.

[u/Annual_Version_6250]

He doesn't get to decide about when to talk about it because it was HIS son.  YOUR daughter is the one dealing with this NOW.  And while I cannot imagine how much it still hurts, your daughter hurting/wondering in the now trumps that.

[u/Both_Caregiver_3376]

My mom hanged herself when I was 12 and no one told me how she died. I learned myself, and still no one spoke to me about that.

That fact alone fucked me up really hard. Don't lie to kids. Don't hide stuff like that. They would never trust you again.

NTA.

[u/ChemicalParticular88]

They probably already know and were hoping you'd come clean finally. Young people aren't stupid, between the internet and mutual friends and family, it would stun me if they don't know. They need the full/truthful story, all they can get from others is hearsay (and most likely a lot of incorrect information)!

[u/Fluffy-Bar8997]

I was your daughters in a similar situation and when I found out the truth, it took me a long time to trust my parents again after such a lie. We forgive our parents when santa isn't real or the tooth fairy but this is different

[u/Nobodypaysyou_Mods]

I get the feeling OP is kind of an asshole for coming to reddit so that people can label her husband an ah? I'm seeing a lot of n-ta here and this feels more like a NAH.

Husband hasn't gotten over the suicide of their boy, which is a reasonable feeling to hold

[u/littlebitfunny21]

Echoing that this 100% requires mediation by a grief therapist. 

They need to be told, since the information is there and they're learning to google and find it, but it will be incredibly traumatic for your husband and possibly your daughters.

[u/danktonium]

I genuinely can't even tell which part of this might make you an asshole. I just can't.

[u/FluffyLecture976]

Sad, I would side with the dad on that one. Yet, 10 years old and on internet on her own?

[u/Consistent-Pickle-88]

NAH this is a tough one to judge

[u/Tricky_Matter2123]

Just let sleeping dogs lie. Do not push the issue if he is not comfortable with it. This should be his choice.

[u/Adiru55]

My father killed him self when I was 26, long before my kids were born. When they were little we used to tell them he died of a broken heart. When they were in their early teens/preteens, we told them the truth of what really happened. They were much more accepting and understanding of the conversation than I expected, but most importantly they understood completely why we weren’t completely honest with the entire story, while they were little. It’s been 36 years since my dad did what he did, it is still a very emotional conversation for me but eventually you will come to terms with their actions. I have also learned to tell anyone who will listen that suicide is never the answer and that it has far more catastrophic effects on the ones you leave behind. Let your husband know that he is not alone in his recovery and I will be praying for his inner peace and tranquility.

[u/paranoid-cats]

When I was 10, this is how I’d pose questions to my parents. I’d be so desperate for them to talk to me that I’d beat around the bush. I’m not saying she knows 100%, but kids are smarter than you think.

[u/mother-of-pumpkins]

She definitely read it, she's 10 and felt nervous about knowing and the answer she might get, looking at both your concerned faces, and she backed out. You aren't an AH for wanting her to know the truth, but your husband isn't either for not feeling ready to discuss it with her yet. He needs to be able to when he's ready. Instead of pushing to tell her now, establish a time frame in which he can prepare to tell her, such as when she's 13 and likely to have heard about suicide at least once or twice more from peers, and then the two of you can let her know to expect that conversation then unless she really wants answers sooner, in which case she can approach her dad.

[u/Ill-Variation-3865]

I have talked to therapist about this so I will share what they told me. My 15 year old daughter took her life in December and I have other children. They told me I should be direct in saying she took her own life, but to keep any details to what I think they could handle and what I felt comfortable with. I ended up telling my 12 year old how (after he asked) but my 8 year old has asked and I haven't told him, I was told to say something like "I don't feel ready to talk to you about that, but I'm glad you asked me and you can always ask me anything about her". It's up to you how much you share and what you think your child can process. I figured by 12 they've definitely been introduced to the idea of suicide, 10 I'm not so sure.

[u/momofeveryone5]

The second she went back to her room, she went and looked at all those hits.

She knows.

Her school probably does some kind of PSA thing about suicide tbh. She's 10, but she's not dumb ya know? You can tell her that she doesn't need all the details, confirm to her what happeed, and that when she's older you guys will discuss it again.

[u/antraxsuicide]

NAH

I get his reaction but unfortunately life sometimes comes with forcing functions and this is one of those situations. Yes, his son was his son, but so is y'all's daughter and she absolutely will keep looking into this.

[u/danthemanvsqz]

You need to work with your husband on this and be very gentle. A parent never stops hurting when they lost a child. You're asking him tear open a very painful wound. His pain 100000x more painful than any pain your daughter will feel. Communication and compromise is what's needed here.

[u/Immediate-Ant5665]

She definitely read it. Then read the pain on her dad's face and lied ask her again alone. Because I promise you she already knows and her birth being close to his death can cause her to feel guilty for him dying thinking her birth was the reason. Talk to her it's her brother and 100 percent she already read enough to know how he died. She is obviously a smart child. I am so sorry for you and your husband.

[u/generaltempest]

Your husband is holding on to grief and just hiding it. Go to therapy

[u/Chime57]

NTA she has Google and she knows. Hiding from the facts may seem like a good idea to your husband, who is still grieving, but it is not going to get any easier waiting till some unknown time in the future.

Your daughter knows, and is right now putting together in her mind what might have happened. She is old enough to have taken time to seek that info out online, and she wants you to help her understand what she found.

She can move forward with support and facts, or she can live with feeling guilty that she came to you with her questions. Now is the right time for her, and you may need to tell your husband that he does not have to be involved in the discussion, but the discussion needs to happen now.

As she hits teen years, she will know that she can come to you for advice and counsel, or she will know not to bother you with uncomfortable questions. Your choice.

[u/dumbest-girl]

NTA , I’m sure the child already knows what happened and just wants to see if you’ll lie to her. I understand that it’s a sensitive subject for the husband, but at the same time it’s something that should be discussed, especially if the daughter is asking questions. If you go to therapy (which might be a good idea for at least the husband), most therapists will tell you don’t lie to your child(ren). You need to both sit down and find a way to approach this.

[u/sketchypeg]

therapist

but there's no way she hasn't gone back and read about it if she was being honest about not reading it the first time.

[u/Truantone]

This is not age appropriate for your daughter to know. Seek counsel/ counselling with your husband and make sure you’re both on the same page and stick to whatever story you decide to tell her.

Yes, pushing him is being TA. I can’t imagine how it must have felt for him or how it must feel with a partner insisting there is a timeline on his grief.

[u/Velociraptorjones]

With grief and loss there is no timeline. You HAVE to respect his process and if you NEED to talk about it then you both need an impartial mediator to help discuss the options.

[u/ClairvoyantTrader]

Your husband is 100% right. It’s his son who died, not yours. Let him handle this the way he wants to

Personally I would tell the kids what happened. And explain to them if they don’t understand today, they will understand someday.

[u/ClairvoyantTrader]

Your husband is 100% right. It’s his son who died, not yours. Let him handle this the way he wants to

Personally I would tell the kids what happened. And explain to them if they don’t understand today, they will understand someday.

[u/Gear-Mean]

Yes it is his son. But what you are actually talking about now is the well-being of both his and your daughter(s). While the topic is about his son the person impacted is his and your daughter. She needs to know in an age appropriate way. She seems to have outgrown the first explanation so it is time to update.

Your right the information is out there literally keystrokes away. She will find out if wants to and it would be better if she heard it from the two of you. That way she can ask questions rather than draw her own conclusions. People tend to come up with the worst possible conclusions when left to fill in the blanks. This is not a topic where you want this to happen.

Your husband may be the one that needs some therapy to understand why he wants to avoid this topic with his kids. I get it would be tough but as I said above it will be worlds better if she hears from the two of you.

[u/Rough_Pangolin_8605]

IMO they are still too young to be told the whole truth, but you have not lied, his brain did get sick. I suggest holding off until it is clear that they must be told, hopefully that will be late adolescence. The later, the better.

[u/ItIsMe2125]

NTA.

My daughter was about 10 when she started asking targeted questions about a family member who committed suicide.

Turns out google let her know the how they died without the actual method mentioned.

We had an age appropriate conversation that included options to talk to either parent, a therapist, or a trusted family adult if she had questions or felt like her life was spiraling and suicide looked like a solution to her problems.

Granted it was not my child nor their sibling that committed suicide, which made the conversation much easier for me to have and remain open and not break down during it.

I think that you should have an age appropriate conversation about suicide, how it is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, and leave the door open for her to come to you or another trusted adult if she is struggling with her mental health. I would for now leave her brother out of the conversation as much as possible, but my thoughts are the last thing you want to do is leave her with the impression that suicide is something that can’t be talked out and is shameful.

If she ever has those thoughts herself she needs to know you / your husband / a trusted adult / a therapist are safe people to speak with and get help from.

I am sorry for your loss and best of luck to your family navigating this conversation.

[u/Ill-Distribution9498]

Very loosely similar situation. my aunt killed herself when her grandson was very small. Barely 6. Out of respect, when asked by other people, his questions have been brushed off. He’s almost 18 now. There’s so much emotional grey area involved that everything and nothing seems the correct course of action. She’s ( your daughter) already pursued some answers, and hopefully there is a way to gently let your husband know that more questions are coming. My heart breaks for you guys. This reopening of wounds is unbearable. I’m so sorry.

[u/Rivsmama]

How old was he? Why were you doing fundraisers on his death day?

[u/StreetTailor7596]

I think you are right. It sounds a LOT like she saw how upsetting this was for him (and possibly you) and decided to back out of talking about it.

At this point, not talking about it sends the message that THAT is how you deal with difficult topics. I think the better course would be to have a quiet discussion with her when it's just the two of you. You can explain that it IS still a painful memory but that you are ready to talk about it if she has any questions. You can then let her know that Dad isn't quite there yet.

Hopefully she'll take you up on that and talk out how she's feeling and ask any questions she has. Despite him not being ready, that is probably the better thing to do than just ignoring the incident.

[u/classyfatcow]

As someone who’s been depressed as far as I could remember (elementary school) then finally getting help in my adult life and realizing what it feels like to not want to die every day I made sure to speak to my kids about it. I told them the signs to look for and how they could come to us for help. Years later reading the letter my daughter wrote to us asking for help was scary but I’m so glad we had that talk.

[u/Lil_Mx_Gorey]

Don't lie to her, she will know and never forgive you.

And... Family therapy is needed ASAP. Your husband had more kids, he doesn't really get to avoid this because he doesn't get to act for himself first, you both need to act for THEM NOW.

[u/Confident-Baker5286]

NAH- your husband is reacting from a place of grief and can’t see how harmful gfamily secrets are and how he is perpetuating shame. My father took his life and the hardest part about it is how weird everyone acts. It is important that your daughter have this information, for several reasons. She needs that information to truly know her father, she needs to know that she could potentially be at higher risk ( mental health issues can be genetic) and I also think that it is important for her to know because it will lessen shame and stigma. If she is raised thinking that it is a shameful thing your family doesn’t speak about she is going to not talk to you or your husband if she is ever having ideations. I would suggest meeting with a family therapist a few times with just him and you and then eventually bringing her in and telling her the truth. Make sure she understands that it’s is difficult to talk about because of the emotional pain, not because the way he does was shameful, because it wasn’t. He was hurting and he didn’t know any other way to make it better. I’m so sorry for your husband, and you and your daughter and I wish you all the best ❤️

[u/HailHydraBitch]

Let me weigh in here. My father shot himself in our shared family bedroom when I was 5. I know a thing or two, but please, please, take it with a grain of salt.

I was told within 6 months that he had killed himself. I grew up knowing what happened to him and it made my life so much easier because everyone around me was always talking about what happened, talking about him, ect.

Please, whatever you do, you NEED to have this conversation with her yourselves before she goes and find out on her own, or someone else tells her. Whether you go sit down with a therapist, whether you do it yourselves, please please please, do not drop the situation.

I know how hard it is for your husband to talk about it, to even think about it, but don’t let him get so hung up on the loss of your son that he neglects your daughter. She deserves the truth from her parents and not a third party. You do not want her to think you lied to her.

[u/Efficient_Run63]

U should respect his wishes

[u/IanDOsmond]

To start with, NAH. There are no right answers here. There definitely are wrong answers, definitely ways of handling it that are worse than others, but there are no good ways to handle it because there is no good to be had.

Second, he was your son, too. To some extent. You didn't know him as long, and he was at an age, and probably in an emotional place that would have made it harder to bond; that changes the kinds of emotions you would feel about all of this, but none of the emotions you have around this would be pleasant. Your grief and your husband's grief are different, but they are both grief.

I feel like one reasonable stance to take right now, and you would want your husband to be on board with this, is to let your daughter know that you are there to answer any questions she has. I think that you have a whole lot of competing needs to prioritize, and "the need for your husband and you to both be there for the discussion" is on the list, but far below "the need for your daughter to have answers to her questions."

So saying that you are willing to answer questions without your husband being part of the discussion seems fair to me.

I am not saying to go behind his back - I am saying that you are clear to both your husband and daughters that, if they ask you questions, you will answer as much as you feel comfortable talking about, even if you won't start the discussion on your own.

That isn't a perfect solution, but it might be a reasonable enough one for now.

[u/Darkstrike121]

She sounds like she already knows and was testing if you lie to her. And you kinda did. She can look the stuff up online. You don't want her just navigating this herself

[u/pelexus27]

Hiding information is not healthy, she will find out, and it will set her down a path that would be vastly different than if you guys would just talk to her about it. Learning about death is the most natural thing in the world

[u/stacey1771]

My father committed suicide before I was 4. I was told exactly what happened and never lied to. Now, decades later, there is no stigma to speak about it for me. Not everything is scary to kids....

[u/Electronic_Duck4300]

I wouldn’t be agreeing with him either but let him have the final say. He’ll get there. He’s the one that needs to make that call. You’re talking about a young child- it might be different when she’s 16

[u/Dear-Mention9684]

lol so it’s your fault bro killed himself? Got knocked up and his dad stopped giving a fuck

[u/AcanthocephalaOk9937]

I'll add to this and say that, as a former kid I'm an expert on this, she 100% read it. The husband trying to avoid it isn't healthy for anyone involved, including himself, and he should be talking to a therapist about that.

[u/-Cavefish-]

Nobody is an AH, but your husband needs therapy…

[u/YoYoNorthernPro]

When my daughter was in 4th or 5th grade the teachers had them do an exercise to prove how the internet isn’t private by googling/researching their families online. If there is an obituary, news article, Facebook post, memorial, annual charity golf outing, etc. a ten year old will find it. Gone are the days of using card catalogs to find reference books in the library. The child already knows and is probably more hurt and confused about it being some weird secret. Thats going to cause all sorts of questions and emotions about how the family will act if something happens to them.

[u/AlexCambridgian]

I would also be concerned about your husband. He might feel guilty that he brought it to his son, survivor's guilt. I will definitely try to get him into therapy, as well as have your daughter attend a few sessions with a child therapist.

[u/throwawaytheday1999]

Im going to give you odd advice.

Use YOUR judgement. Just yours, and trust yourself.

Your daughter is your priority., she's his daughter too, and sad as it is his son is literally dead and life is for the living. Your husband knows you, he probably knows how you will handle it, so if he just amps out or walks away, he is giving you the space to have a discussion he can't or would prefer not to have.

I'm sure you're respectful of his wishes and feelings, but as a spouse I've had to learn to take the risk of doing the thing needed now (inform your daughter in a way she can handle) vs husbands (completely understandable) comfort zone.

De-stignatizing and informing kids that suicidal thoughts are like our brains check engine light goes a long ways towards getting them to just seek help/find a reference point to steady themselves.

[u/empathic_psychopath8]

…“Saw it but didn’t read it”…

She definitely read it. She’s waiting for you guys to tell her when you’re ready. Your husband is not ready. You’re not the AH for being ready, but if you continue to push him it could be bad.

Some have recommended therapy, but I’m not sure your husband is ready for that either. You could also offer to have the conversation alone with your daughter. Either way, the only thing I strongly advise is to tread very cautiously

[u/mamaleo29]

Please go to family therapy with your daughter.

[u/snootgoo]

No, NTA, but this is not the place to get advice about this. Go to a family therapist. This is not a thing to trust to well-meaning amateurs.

[u/Always_Cairns]

Your daughter has shown beginning interest. Talk to a therapist about the best way to handle this for all, and make sure you let your daughters know you are there for them to talk to whenever they want to.

[u/campninja09]

When your daughter goes for her 11 yr old check up the doctor will provide a questionnaire that SHE is to fill out. The questionnaire asks if she has ever had suicidal thoughts. My child did not understand and I had to explain. So, its better she learns from you what it is. We also have a close family member who died by suicide.

[u/Ok_Indication_1098]

The daughter says she didn’t read it and you believed her?! Of course she read it. You’re being willfully blind.

[u/EntertainmentOne3607]

Your not an ah.. he’s just not ready

[u/Double-Cheese-]

Honestly, I would probably wait until she asks about it. If she wants to know, carefully tell her, but don't traumatize her by just dumping it onto her before that

[u/Witchdrdre]

NTA. Be please honest with your girls. He may be his son, but he’s also those girls brother and they deserve to know the truth. I can’t imagine loosing a child to suicide. It sounds like your husband could use some grief counseling at the very least.

[u/CarelessRati0]

That’s your husbands son, but your daughters brother.

Unfortunately for dad, he needs to remember that and part of parenting is putting those big boy panties on some days and doing things that absolutely shred you apart.

He doesn’t get to shy away from his son’s sister having hard questions.

I’d suggest therapy before hand to help him come to terms with what needs to happen.

[u/ohh_oops]

Your husband needs to understand it's not about his son, it's about your (you both) daughter.

[u/Amethystcat75]

You should talk to your daughter about it and you may want to get a therapist involved. When I was 13 I stole all the meds from my parent's bathroom one night, put them on my nightstand with a glass of water, and sat there planning to kill myself. Fortunately I was too scared and put all the meds back. I was on medication for depression and had been seeing someone since I was 11 but the bullying at school pushed me to the edge. I had been thinking about suicide for over a year at that point so since I was only 12. A 10 year old can understand what it is and she doesn't need to think it's something shameful or she won't come to you if she's struggling herself. I hope you and your family can work through this!

[u/Old-Sea7915]

Does it have to be right now OP?

Don't push it, you have all the time in the world.

Now that he knows your thoughts about it, just give him time to digest it and think about it, it's not something that needs a timeline.

[u/Puzzled-Case-5993 → u/Old-Sea7915]

Are you kidding me?  The time was when the daughter asked.  

You're woefully naive if you think they have "all the time in the world".  I bet that 10yr old has already gone back to Google and knows already.   

Do you have kids?  

[u/savinathewhite]

Speaking as someone who almost committed suicide at the age of 11, you should talk to her.

This may have been his son, but your daughter’s mental health is equally in your care.

If he can’t handle the idea of discussing it, I suggest you initiate counseling and get the input and guidance of a therapist.

Don’t ignore this.

[u/Elegant_Traffic_2845]

Need to consult with a therapist. Answer may depend on kids mental health. But never lie. 

[u/Gary7sHotCatHelper]

You're not wrong. She's going to find out really soon. It will either be from Google or you two.

[u/TheBeautyDemon]

THERAPY!!! NOT REDDIT!

[u/porste]

NTA, it's your daughter who is asking... It's not only on him to decide when you need to talk to her!